A little over a year ago at the NCAA convention, a proposal to make all of the NCAA’s data public was defeated. Enough peer pressure was put on and, in our opinion, misinformation spread, that the proposal was eventually withdrawn.
A compromise, it was said, would be to make public the data in a handful of sports, through posting PDF files, rather than issuing each school a login to a system that already exists for members of regional ranking committees to use.
We know full well the embarrassment of incorrect data and how D3sports.com people must now check every sport’s championship handbook on its release to make sure that the right number of Pool B and Pool C teams are being awarded. This year, in fact, the women’s basketball committee again had to revise their handbook, having promised twice as many Pool B bids as the numbers actually provided for.
So while they won’t open all of their data, they have opened women’s basketball up for us to look at. We always figure the more eyes on data, the better. That’s why our data has always been open and public, and corrections come in throughout the season. That’s because our system, like the NCAA’s, is reliant on schools entering schedules and results, and sometimes typos occur, or sometimes schools just don’t understand what defines a regional game.
At the bottom of this week’s women’s basketball release on the NCAA Web site there are links to PDF files for each of the eight regions which contain the numbers for each team. What we’re concerned with is the first number: the regional win-loss record. That’s the basis for every other number when calculating strength of schedule.
Compare those numbers to the regional record listed with our strength of schedule numbers. This file is currently through the same day, Sunday, Feb. 7. While we continually audit our own database to make sure no errors occur, we have not been able to audit theirs until now.
In contrast, the men have provided little/no information about their data. We only have the regional rankings to look at. Here’s what I sent to the NCAA about men’s basketball, and it was all in the Mid-Atlantic region. Through Sunday’s games:
Albright: We have 15-4; NCAA has 14-3. Every game on Albright’s schedule
should be in-region except for Berkeley. Nazareth is an administrative
region game, TCNJ and Richard Stockton are under 200 miles.
Lycoming: We have 12-4; NCAA has 13-4. Perhaps Shenandoah or New Jersey
City are the culprits. It’s 202 miles from Lyco to New Jersey City and 212
from Lyco to Shenandoah. Also out of region: Franciscan, Penn
State-Hazelton and Penn College.
St.Mary’s (Md.): We have 15-3; NCAA has 14-3. Possible culprits include
Hampden-Sydney (175 miles) or Christopher Newport (179 miles).
York (Pa.): We have 15-4; NCAA has 14-4. The only non-regional games for
York are against Penn State-York and Penn State-Abington. Perhaps
first-year MBB program Rosemont isn’t being marked correctly? Rosemont is
a full NCAA Division III member. Mount Aloysius is also possible.
My frustration is that D-III is the ideal place to open the data to all willing volunteers who will do plenty of the tedious “scut-work” for the love of the game.
A simple change in attitude in the NCAA would make these tasks so much better and the database that results would be more accurate and more valuable to all who follow D-III.
Please check the Handbooks of the various sports. Almost every D-III school has at least one coach or administrator on a committee. We know these people who are doing the “heavy lifting” to conduct a well-run championship. Ihave felt badly when a coach or AD whom I know to run a “tight ship” gets faulty data from the NCAA upon which to make decisions.
Thanks, Pat. Hopefully they can get it right.
Here’s what I sent the NCAA.
Started the men’s records tonight.
Centenary: We have 9-11; NCAA has 8-10. John Carroll seems to be the only non-regional game. Bard, Montclair State and TCNJ are 200-mile games.
Gwynedd-Mercy: We have 10-8; NCAA has 9-8. The game in question could be St. Lawrence, which is an administrative region game. Rutgers-Camden also possible, a 200-mile game.
La Roche: We have 10-11; NCAA has 10-10. Every game should be in-region. Perhaps third-year provisional Geneva is the issue.
Marywood: We have 4-13; NCAA has 3-12. Non-region games are Penn St.-Wilkes-Barre, Hazelton and Scranton. Non-conference regional games would be Misericordia and Wilkes. If Rosemont is an issue, Marywood plays them twice.
Neumann: We have 8-8; NCAA has 9-8. Penn State-Abington is probably the issue.
Penn State-Abington. We have 0-0; NCAA has 0-7. As a first-year provisional member, Abington’s games cannot be regional.
Penn State-Harrisburg. We have 9-4; NCAA has 10-5. Abington is probably part of the equation. Non-region games are Penn State-Schuylkill, Valley Forge Christian, SUNY-Cobleskill; Abington, Penn State-York, Abington again. (And Cobleskill Feb. 14.)
Pitt-Bradford: We have 12-8; NCAA has 11-8. Aside from Marietta, every game is regional. Buff State and Nazareth are in the same administrative region and Franciscan is a regional game because they’re in the same conference. (If the rules are different for Franciscan, let me know and I’ll change on our end.)
Salisbury: We have 8-8; NCAA has 8-7. Christopher Newport and Virginia Wesleyan are 200-mile games. Goucher, St. Mary’s and Johns Hopkins to open the season are all administrative region games.
Scranton: We have 10-7; NCAA has 9-7. Perhaps Bard (administrative region), either Kean game (200 miles).
CCNY: We have 6-14; NCAA has 6-13. The only non-region games for CCNY are Berkeley and Gallaudet. Perhaps St. Joseph’s Brooklyn. Other non-Atlantic teams that are in-region games were Mitchell, Buffalo State.
New York City Tech: We have 2-19; NCAA has 2-18. Perhaps St. Lawrence, Trinity (Conn.), Lebanon Valley, Franklin and Marshall.
John Jay: We have 1-19; NCAA has 1-18. Manhattanville, Connecticut College (twice), King’s and Wilkes are non-Atlantic Region 200-mile opponents.
Lehman: We have 7-14; NCAA has 6-14. Only win I see that could be confused is St. Joseph’s-Brooklyn.
New Jersey City: We have 10-8; NCAA has 10-9. It’s 202 miles from Lycoming to New Jersey City. (I know it’s less than 200 miles in the other direction according to TES. I’ve been told to run the mileage in the direction the road team traveled. Still the case?)
Richard Stockton: We have 14-5; NCAA has 15-5. Penn State-Abington is a likely discrepancy.
Rowan: We have 11-6; NCAA has 12-6. Penn State-Abington is a likely discrepancy.
St. Joseph’s (Bklyn.): We have 2-10; NCAA has 2-9. Perhaps Trinity (Conn.) or Lancaster Bible. Widener also possible.
Staten Island: We have 9-11; NCAA has 9-10. This could also be Lycoming — exactly at 200 miles, should be a regional game. Can’t see any other losses that would be in question, though Stevens is also a 200-mile game.
Alfred: We have 6-10; NCAA has 7-10. Penn State-Abington is a likely discrepancy.
Cobleskill: We have 0-0; NCAA has 2-2. Cobleskill is a second-year provisional and unable to play regional games.
Hilbert: We have 2-18; NCAA has 2-19. The Penn State-Du Bois game is the only non-regional game.
Keuka: We have 3-11; NCAA has 3-10. Not sure which game might be at issue. Perhaps one of the Jan. 15-16 tournament games didn’t get marked right.
Morrisville State: We have 3-9; NCAA has 3-8. The regional losses: Medgar Evers, Clarkson, Keuka, SUNYIT, Penn St.-Harrisburg, Penn St.-Berks, Penn St.-Harrisburg, Keuka, Oswego State.
Plattsburgh State: We have 12-6; NCAA has 11-6. Lyndon State and Norwich are 200-mile games.
SUNYIT: We have 12-4; NCAA has 11-4. The in-region wins: Utica, New Paltz, Hamilton, PS-Harrisburg, Morrisville, Keuka, Cazenovia, Utica, PS-Berks, Cazenovia, Wells, Keuka.
Skidmore: We have 11-8; NCAA has 8-6. Skidmore crosses over with a bunch of 200-mile New England region teams: Southern Vermont, Johnson State, Trinity (Conn.), Castleton State, Norwich and Middlebury.
Union: We have 10-8; NCAA has 10-7. Union also crosses over with New England teams, including losses to Western Connecticut, Middlebury, Western New England.
Vassar: We have 1-17; NCAA has 0-15. The win is probably Newbury: 198 miles each direction. Richard Stockton is a 200-mile game, as is Brandeis, Williams, Amherst and Ramapo.
This is East, Atlantic and Mid-Atlantic.
What an embarrassment. Clearly, they aren’t even trying.
And isn’t it possible that a school could lose out on a Pool C bid to the NCAA tournament because of these mistakes. It’s bad enough teams have to survive upsets on the court; if I was a coach or player I’d be pretty UPSET if my chance to dance was taken from me because the NCAA can’t get their facts straight.
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Hello. This is deiscanton posting under my modified d3blogs.com name of desicanton1– my e-mail changed some months back and my old handle didn’t match my current e-mail address.
The purpose of my writing here today is to ask the NCAA to check the Brandeis men’s reported in-region results vs regionally ranked opponents. I have Brandeis at 1-2 vs regionally ranked opponents while the NCAA reports it at 2-3.
As of week 2, Wash U and NYU were the other UAA teams ranked regionally by the NCAA. Through Sunday, Brandeis’s record vs Wash U and NYU is 1-2 (It was 1-1 when UMass-Dartmouth was still regionally ranked, but UMass-Dartmouth has since dropped out of the regional rankings for week 3.)
Currently, none of Brandeis’s non-conference opponents are regionally ranked by the NCAA. Brandeis played in non-conference Lasell, Emerson, UMass-Dartmouth, Vassar, Clark, Framingham State, Salem State, Tufts, Curry, Bates, and Amherst. Out of those 11– only UMass-Dartmouth had gotten a regional ranking, but is no longer regionally ranked.
That means that the only regionally ranked teams that Brandeis played this season are the UAA opponents currently regionally ranked, and Brandeis is now 1-2 vs Wash U and NYU– with one more chance at a currently regionally ranked opponent when NYU comes to Brandeis on Feb. 27.
Brandeis’s regional percentage and strength of schedule numbers are correct– which is the crucial thing. Perhaps the NCAA confused the Salem State women with the Salem State men and gave the Brandeis men an extra win?