While Pat and Gordon were pretty darn close in their predictions, nailing 31 of 32 teams and missing on Whitworth (UW-Eau Claire made it instead), it’s clear we’d grown accustomed to the committee being fairly predictable.
Perhaps it’s because there was only one West Coast team in the field, but whatever the reason, they were anything but this time around. The bracket has been revealed, and some curveballs have been thrown.
Ithaca at Mount Union, Redlands at St. John’s and Widener at Case Western Reserve were among the matchups we did not see coming. You can throw Olivet at Central in there too. With the proximity of so many of the teams, the committee’s matchups did not hold to the regions. For years they have not had to, but often they simply shake out that way. In Saturday’s first round, we’ll have an East Region team at a North, a North at a West in two different brackets and two South Region teams who could have been moved to the East playing each other. And then Redlands flying halfway across the country … but still Texas vs. Texas.
Without further ado, the floor is open for your reactions.
Grizfan I must disagree with you about the tailgate party. Last year when we played at your school we had about 10 Franklin girls partying with us at our tailgate b4 sitting w/ us the entire game. But Franklin is good and North Central will be a good test. I think you do have a shot lets say a puncher’s chance at knocking out UWW.
Pat, Spokane and the Whitworth community deserves answers about their snubbing. And don’t gives us the win opponets win percentage formula crap. Its real cut and dry on who should be in and shouldn’t come down to those numbers. Everyone deserves an explanation on what really happened.
Cjdel:
Yep, we do predictions later in the week. Check back on Wednesday or Thursday for those.
Danimal … THAT was LAST year !! There are TWO new sheriffs in town for FC tailgates !! And they get better every week !! We will certainly throw a roundhouse or two at the opponents — hope we connect !! Tough to defend — multifaceted offense. Just need the D to show up. They didn’t show up at Wabash early in the season !
North Carolina Wesleyan over W&J. NCW played Wesley within 3 points in the first game of the year. NCW has gotten better throughout the year and those tough NON-conference games at the beginning of the year will pay dividends in the playoffs.
Pat/Keith – has a #1 seed ever fallen to an 8 seed?
I think this will be a good game though W&J is #1 for a reason.
And my other upset alert…..Mt. Union loses….um…wait…never mind.
RunFerrum – I like your line of thinking – just don’t like that you backed away from it.
Ithaca can win, they won’t roll over the way the team’s from the Purple Patsies Conference (OAC) does every week.
SJF, the 31F lot you’re referring to is about 2 mi from my house. I was thinking the same thing, (10 AM tailgate). Yes you are correct, 7 game win streak and some very impressive offensive stats. However, I have seen your team and believe SJF is once again the team to beat in upstate NY. Not any obvious weaknesses. I agree re: IC. If lightening strikes and they somehow pull off the D-3 upset of the century, there is no telling how far IC could go. Hey, MUC can’t go undefeated forever (can they?) I know SJF would like another shot at them!
Hey Bucfan: I’m all set to enjoy the playoffs in Division 3.
That being said…let’s re-visit for the last time our hindsight and dissappointment…
We in the NWC are a bit put off by not getting a rep in the postgame; Whitworth should have had a shot! I’m not too sure that you’re thoughts regarding Linfield getting in if they had prevailed over Whitworth is valid. I don’t think the Cats had any more chance than the Rats of being able to represent the NWC.
From our point of view(yours, mine and all of us in the conference) we can hope for continued great programs from all of our member schools and let’s say a prayer for Lewis and Clark…that they can somehow overcome and stay active in the game. We need that and more to establish and maintain the integrity of our conference.
Now…let’s enjoy some good football…D3 style!
Well those girls came back this year but I just assumed that was due to the few big parties we had. But your team is good and legit except a little shaky on def. I know you want to say that this is b/c of a bad day but Wabash put up 38 last year and that was Huff’s first start in over a year. Home field will hopefully give your team the advantage. I do like Franklin except for that god awful siren. I do hope it’s Franklin vs. Wabash in the regional final.
Hey Keith MacMillan … did I read you went to Triton? Washington Township – class of 75 … I know — WAAAYY before your time !
Hey Bomber, just to set one fact straight. UMHB has not lost in the first round of the playoffs since 2002.
2004 – Stagg Bowl appearance losing to Linfield
2005 – First Round – UMHB beat Trinity in surprising first round match up, lost to Wesley in the Second Round
2006 – First Round -UMHB beat Hardin-Simmons, Second Round – best W&J and then lost to Wesley in the Qurterfinals.
Just wanted to clarify a point you made earlier. Thanks!
Ahh, thanks bro
I think i saw a 9-2 record and assumed..oops
SJF Fan,
Could you explain the OAC’s SECOND TEAM playoff record since 1996 of 12-7 with 6 of those losses against Mount. Looks like 12-1 against all others. Patsies?? Yep, …. and Tiger Woods is a hacker.
No worries…the other loss in 2005 came to Howard Payne in the regular season.(not sure how that happened….no offense meant to any yellow jacket fans of HPU.) The six UMHB losses you speak of since 2004….2 to UWW, 2 to Wesley in the playoffs, one to HPU and one to Christopher Newport. The last team to beat MU in the playoffs….UMHB. Certainly not comparing the two teams this year. UMHB would have to get through the rest of some tough teams and then face UWW for a re-match. Not sure any team can compete with Mount Union this year…..but we still have to play the games. Funny thing isn’t it. 🙂
First time poster and longtime fan of MUC. I am excited for this years bracket as I get to follow MUC against some quality East teams. I live in Upstate and constantly follow the area teams of Hartwick, Cortland, Ithaca, Brockport and St. John Fisher. As a Mount fan I would state that we are all excited to play and see some quality football. I too am excited to see MUC placing SJF on the schedule for the next two seasons. I can now get to see one MUC game here in NY. Heres to a great tournament!
ferrum…..
NCW vs W&J will be a good game like all of the first round games in the south region.. however NCW will not prevail….this is their very first playoff game, 500 miles away in a hostile environment…they will be close for most of the game…in the end they will not have the experience to pull it off… also their defense will not stop W&J (swallow is the all divisions leader in QB rating and will improve on his stats in this one) final score W&J 38 NCW 24
Statesman78 – you do not have to worry about SJFC looking past Hobart. We all know how great of a team Hobart really is. If it wasn’t for a couple of bad plays, Hobart would be undefeated and riding a 9 game winning streak. The only team I did not want Fisher to face in round 1 was Hobart – but I guess you have to beat the best to be the best. I look forward to watching a great game on Saturday!
The Great Pumpkin did an excellent preview of the game in post patterns (I believe on page 1926). I don’t agree with his final score (Hobart 27, SJFC 24) though; I think the final will be SJFC 34 Hobart 24.
On November 12th, 2007 at 10:34 am, Ron Boerger said:
Watch and learn, grasshopper, watch and learn. Until you see the Raiders in person, you have no idea what you’re in for. Make a trip to Alliance if you have the chance and you’ll find out what most of the rest of us have over the years – they simply ARE that good.
For those saying “hey so and so played MUC close last year”, my experience has been if you actually do manage to play the Raiders close one year all it does is focus them to come beat the tar out of you the next. Maybe this year will be different but I wouldn’t hold my breath.
Should a team from the East defeat MUC, I’ll be the first to come here, congratulate that team, and admit I was wrong. BTW, anyone who thinks MUC is my team clearly hasn’t been around the South Region boards since the site was created.
Mr. Boerger, your post was spot-on – to a point. If a team from the East defeat MUC, they should be congratulated. Apologize for thinking Mount would not be defeated? No. On any given Saturday, it is not likely. On any Saturday, it is a possibility. Mount is not perfect and has lost football games in the recent 15 years. They will lose, again and again; but, not often perhaps for years to come. When they lose, they will not hang their heads. They will congratulate the victors and look forward to an opportunity to redeem themselves and to vanquish the victors when next they meet. For years, Coach Keeler and Rowan carried the torch for the East – obsessively dedicated to smashing the domination of the Raiders. This year, three East teams will line up (gang up?) on the Raiders. One of them may well defeat Mount Union on some coming Saturday. Will that end the Purple Reign? End the dominance of Mount Union Football? Probably. For 8 or 9 months.
Comment on SJF fan being a purple raider hater. I’m glad to see Capital get moved into a different bracket. Do some homework and look at OAC teams winning percentages in the playoffs when they play someone other than Mount.
I am not real tactful so I will say “snubbing Whitworth was a back eye for DIII”. Linfield was ranked No. 12 even after losing to Willamette, yet I would wager if they beat Whitworth going 5-1 in league they would have made the playoffs.
Whitworth beat the No. 12 team went undefeated in league play and were snubbed. They did lose early to a league champ, more power to Redlands, and to Azusa Pacific in a close game on the road but snubbing them for a team that lost two league game was not justified. Go look yourself in the mirror.
Congratulations to fans of the “other 31” teams participating in the NCAA D-III National Playoffs this year. As for me, I’m getting tired of reading about Mount Union already. No question, the Purple Raiders are the most consistent football program in the country (any division) over the past decade — enough said.
Let’s here what some of the rest of you think about your team’s chances this weekend, who will be 2007 regional champions, which players will rise to the occasion come playoff time, etc.
One last thought, I wouldn’t want to be Bethel and face the prospect of having to play a UW – Eau Claire team — on a mission to prove it belongs — in the 2nd round…!
Obviously Mt. Union will win everything…but besides that there is a lot of room for upsets. I think the central bracket will be a rematch between Bethel and St. Johns…but Bethel will win again. The Washington and Jefferson bracket is the hardest to predict. Is UMHB that bad to get destroyed by UWW…or were they just off. Either way they are a 4 seed after being #2 in the country for a while. In the end, Wesley will win a nail-bitter with Washington and Jeffereson. In the UWW bracket, UWW will overlook its second round opponent (I hope) either North Central or an under-rated Franklin team. This will be the upset special. Wabash (after beating the no schedule Case Western that almost lost to OWU) and Franklin will meet again. I pick Wabash to beat Franklin. In the finals, Wesley will get blown out by Mount Union.
Wesley-17 (generous) Mount Union-49
arnolddb, i like your thinking. wesley to make the final, that would be great. i agree that the south is the most balanced bracket with 6 ranked teams. wesley is battle tested with 3 opponents making the show, defeating all 3. i have not checked to see if anyone else has that on their resume. they were sloppy with the ball early in the year, it cost them in their only lose, or we may be talking about who should be #1 in the south wash and jeff or an undefeated wesley. i find all the whining about muc funny. they are the best, how can it be questioned, but i would love to see wesley get to play them. that would mean wesley possibly defeated uww after losing twice to them. you may be right, they might get blown out, but i would like to see the game.
Whitworth had a nice year and was certainly worthy of consideration for an at-large playoff spot. However, the outcries of “injustice”, and “black-eye for D3 fball” is mis-guided. There should be no debate that the WIAC is a superior conference to NWC, top to bottom. Whit and UWEC had one common opponent, UW-Stout. Whitworth beat them on a pass play on the games final play, at home. At best, Whitworth and UWEC are on par, hard to pick between the two. At worst, Whitworth is a 3 or 4 loss team in the WIAC, just like UW Stout. There are no cupcakes in the WIAC, and you have UWW. Whitworth had a couple nice wins, but you cannot tell me that they had clearly better credentials than UWEC…it’s just not so. You can be disappointed that your team did not receive a bid, but spare me the howls of injustice….it does not pass any reasonable sniff test.
Remember, Whitworth was ranked AHEAD of UWEC in the regional rankings before goint into the final week. Their in region record was 8-1 vs. UWEC’s 5-2.
And how does one explain the E8 getting THREE teams in – while the NWC champ doesn’t get a taste??? An Ithaca team with TWO in region losses, one by 21 points at home, gets a Pool C bid (the 2nd Pool C for the E8) while a one loss Whitworth out of the respected NWC doesn’t? Please. Three bids (two Pool Cs) to the Empire 8 and ZERO for the NWC and their one regional loss champ??? Yeah, that makes sense.
Most of the outcry from Whitworth fans seem to be directed at UWEC’s bid. When comparing their body of work, regardless of ‘rankings’, there is not a clear case that Whitworth should have been chosen over UWEC, and I would certainly argue that the committee made the right, albeit tough, choice. As far as your commentary on the E8, your point is excellent and is shared.
Furnaceman – you seem very bent on citing past playoff records.
The debate on my end is calling into question the ’07 version of the OAC. The numbers I think suggest that the conference is having an off year.
since d3g brought this up I do not understand the comment that Whitworth would lose 3 or 4 games in the WIAC. I looked at the records of the teams in WIAC and see some pretty bad records. I would argue the same for most WIAC teams in the NWC. Teams like Whitworth, Linfield, Willamette, and PLU would more than hold their own and most WIAC teams would have no better record in the NWC as thay have in the WIAC. It would be fun for the 2 leagues to have a challenge weekend and see how they would fare against each other. Whitworth and Stout have been 2 great games PLU has handled Falls and in the past I believe Linfield has played Steven’s Point. Menlo also played Stout close. Anyway let the playoffs begin and good luck to all
After surveying the posts so far, I have some comments/opinions…
1. Any criticism of Mount Union (soft schedule, weak bracket, etc.) is ridiculous. They have earned the right to be respected in every sense.
2. Part of the fun of the debate of any bracket is to argue who should have gotten in that was snubbed. It appears to me that the UWEC/Whitworth comparison came in very close. While Whitworth fans can be very disappointed their team didn’t make it in, I don’t think the committee can be overly criticized by the choice.
3. It seems interesting that fans from Mount Union and UW-Whitewater seem to look forward to the playoffs and don’t really care who they play. It seems like fans of other schools are far more concerned about this.
4. Validity of claims that a UWW/UMHB would turn out differently depends on one’s defnition of differently. The final score was 44-14. If one thinks a second meeting would be closer than that, the claim could be true. If one thinks UMHB would win the game, they are engaged in some VERY wishful thinking. On October 28, New England beat Washington 52-7. Redskin fans might believe it would be different if they met again. And maybe it would be. But Washington would still likely lose.
5. One of the many great things about DIII football is that the championship is still settled on the field.
boobyhasgameyo,
Love the name. Still. Responding to the post from November 12th, 2007 at 4:02 pm:
On the first point, I respect that. Sometimes when someone posts something outrageous we feel compelled to respond, just so that the people who aren’t long-time surfers (remember, someone new is on the site every day) don’t get the wrong impression. Some people know the history, some know the recent history, some know only what has happened since their freshman son started playing this year. Concordia (Wis.) might as well be just as likely to get to Salem as Wis.-Whitewater
On 2) … I think there are actually some legs to the ‘Mount didn’t use its whole arsenal’ theory. I wouldn’t bring it up if I didn’t think so. For starters, as joelmama noted, the run was working, and it’s the safest way to protect a lead. They passed 14 times the whole game, which is uncharacteristic of their offense, and although Garcon looked ineffective that day trying to play with a broken hand, his performance in the Stagg Bowl was so dominant it certainly isn’t out of the realm of possibility that they held him back — maybe not in a ‘we don’t need him to win’ way, but a ‘we don’t have him today’ way.
Please do not confuse that for disrespect for Fisher’s effort. They gave MUC a stiff test and they were rewarded in the final polls and the ’07 preaseason polls. That respect has carried over to this season, where voters seem to have been more forgiving to a puzzling (at the time) loss than they were, say, to Wartburg after it lost to Augsburg or Trinity after Rhodes.
So I mean, on one hand, SJF earned more respect losing to Mount Union than it could have by beating almost anyone else. On the other hand, I have seen enough of Mount Union to believe they are that good that they could have done that.
I know it’s sickening to hear the slobbering 24-7, but it’s like the Patriots in the NFL this year. Slobbering or no slobbering, the team keeps things in perspective, from Kehres down, year after year, and will always be hard to beat.
I’m with you and the other guys from the East in the way I have always been … anyone that beats Mount Union makes the season interesting again, because we have drama, we have parity, we have an opening in Salem, etc.
But in the years I have spent around the Purple Raiders and their fans, I have come to appreciate them in this way: They play the game in a way we all should hope to someday play it. Mistakes are few, sloppy football is rare. A team that beats them — I have seen it happen a few times — earns it. And they don’t do anything to misrepresent D3 or make us as a whole not want to be proud of them, even at the same time we’re all gunning for their crown.
I realize it’s not an easy balance to strike. But we are only jocking them after careful consideration 🙂
To think that UMHB is the Redskins of Div III is just plain nonsense. Perhaps the Cowboys-Patriots game is a slightly better analogy.
CJ,
As Gordon mentioned, there are game-by-game predictions coming Friday. That’s been a tradition the past couple years.
Pat, Gordon and I will also look at all four brackets as a whole and list surprises, disappointments and the eventual champ, as has been ATN tradition for as long as I can remember.
Other brief answers to brief questions/comments:
1. dukefinadv, the “sifting through the crap” thing was a twist on what Ric said himself earlier. Although for the record, unlike Howard Eskin and Angelo Cataldi, I don’t get paid any more or any less based on the number of blog comments.
2. SJFF82, I don’t have to call you an idiot, you make a perfectly good case without my help. ‘Preciate the pointers, but I think I’ll do my style the way I do it, whether you think it’s subtle or not.
I also don’t think I claimed you said anything except what I directly quoted out of your mouth. However, my counter-arguments are not limited to your posts because you are not the only Fisher person having this discussion.
3. sjfc81,
Did I attend MUC? Um, if you have paid, oh, I don’t know, a smidge, of attention over the past week, you should be pretty clear on where I went. As for Mount Union, I don’t particuarly like them anymore than, say, St. John Fisher. I have watched them play for the past several years and I am giving my honest opinions. I’m wrong a lot, but I’m right a lot too, and at the very least people seem to respect the opinions because a good amount of thought goes into them. Seems to have worked for me so far.
The fact that I have no axe to grind for Mount Union should lend even more credibility to the opinion.
However you guys want to take the opinion of the SJF-MUC game, go ahead. Mount Union had/has a dangerous passing attack and they threw the ball 14 times against Fisher. And ran for 378 yards. However you want to take it, take it. I don’t think I’ve ever implied that Mount Union took it easy on SJF, but if you look at the Stagg Bowl the next week, it certainly showed what Mount Union can do when they need to throw it, choose to throw it, whatever. St. John Fisher was not so much better in the secondary than Whitewater to account for that kind of difference. In my opinion.
St. John Fisher gained the vast majority of its top-5 cred by playing as well as they played at Mount Union. No one is saying they are terrible, just saying that game perhaps wasn’t as close at it seemed. It was 19-14 in the 4th, if I recall correctly, so it was always in danger. But then Mount dominated that fourth.
The Rowan win was also a big deal for Fisher, but heading into the playoffs, they were a top 15 team. So take that how you want to take it.
You guys are all free to have your opinions and share them. A couple of you are particuarly defensive when we respond. You want to run off at your misinformed lips, be my guest … just take your feedback like a man.
And for the rest of you out there with legitimate questions who like to play nice, I’ll do whatever I can to help educate us both through discussion too.
I didn’t say brief, did I?
SJFF82,
Do you even consider what you say before you click submit?
“Comparing the play-off numbers to my argument is apples to oranges. I was simply commenting about the level of play and competition on a broader and year to year basis.”
Playoff results from OAC teams absolutely is relevant to the level of play and competition on a year-to-year basis.
Aside from other non-conference games, what could be more relevant?
If you mean OAC teams against each other rather than against the rest of D3, I’d simply ask who was the last team to beat Mount Union?
Go ahead, look it up. I’ll wait.
Plain and simple, the OAC is not a patsy league. Its runner-up many years would be in the mix for the title in most other elite D3 leagues.
You know what,
I love to argue/discuss/what have you … so I am prone to carrying on in these types of discussions, even when it’s not productive.
Bottom line is this: East, the rest of D3 has been dumping on your for years for your lack of Stagg success. (and they mean getting there just as much as winning, FWIW). Now you have the giant in your bracket. Frankly, I think you caught them on the worst year
You want respect? Earn it.
Folks,
I will take a different approach than many as I have no connection to ANY Div-3 program as a student, alumni or as a parent. I generally make it to five football games each fall and 25-30 basketball games, all of which I pay to attend.
Based in Chicago, I prefer to head up to WIAC games as generally, you see a real football game even with UWW’s recent dominance. Head to other local conferences, and you might see one of those “truly exciting” D-3 games – such as Beloit vs. anybody. And those are hard to sit through.
Is MUC good for D-3? Personally, I would rather propose that there are two levels of non-scholarship football. The first level would include the Div 1AA non scholarship teams (NEC, Pioneer) and the top 30-40 teams that generally dominate D3 football. In both cases, the schools take winning football very seriously. Most of the rest of D3 football plays it more or less as a club sport. Success on the field is great but not an overwhelming.
Raiderguy states that there are a good number of Ohio colleges “competing for players.” That is true. In general, the scholarship programs scoop up the premier players as there is some value in a paid scholarship. However, at the non-scholarship level, MUC honestly is not competing with the Earlhams and the Oberlins for football players. Students go to those schools to be students and head out for football. Many high school students head to MUC to play football and to attend college in that order. I am not bashing MUC but there are high school star athletes who are undersized who want to play at MUC who probably had NO CLUE as to where Alliance was located at.
When a school has what 100-150 players coming out for non-scholarship program, it is rather unheard of. Of course, most of them are freshmen and many will leave when it becomes evident that they will not play at MUC. Sometimes they head to other D3 programs; often, they move on to less expensive public universities. However, MUC pretty much has the cream of the non-scholarship crop.
A D3 team beating a D3 team is very possible. The notion that a D3 would beat a top D2 team like Chadron State is very unlikely just due to the size and talent levels.
As for UWW, their defense has been outstanding this year, if they can avoid all the stupid penalties and personal fouls. Their offense is potent or sputtering depending on the afternoon. Few of the league games were blowouts and many were settled in the 4th.
That is my post for the year. Good luck.
As a MUC fan I would like to see more postings and thoughts on things other than the OAC being a weak conference. I understand that things are different from year to year and Capital may not be as good as the last couple of years but lets take a look back at the last few years since the playoffs were expanded. In years where 2 OAC teams have made the playoffs, the 2nd OAC team is 11-1 against teams other than MUC. Also you can look a few years back and see when John Carroll was in the East bracket as a 7 seed. They won the east only to lose to MUC in the Semi-finals. So let’s move on from this subject because there are plenty of other good storylines to debate. When it comes to the OAC conference their record in the playoffs speaks for itself.
jlawrence…your idea regarding integrating the 1-AA “non-scholarship” schools at the top Division III schools is intriguing. Somehow this would have to be determined, but my guess is that you would look at practice time, etc. to set those limits.
But a Division III school beating a non-scholarship I-AA school is not unheard of. UW-Platteville beat Drake for a number of years for instance. The differences between the programs probably isn’t all that great.
BTW, you also hit it right on the head regarding UWW this year. The defense has carried this team because without the Jacobs / Stanley connection, they havn’t been able to stretch the field.
I’m curious about the I-AA non-scholarship comments. Do you think these schools are I-AA in football because they give scholarships in their other sports? In other words, if their basketball teams compete at D-I and they give scholarships to those players, does that disqualify them from being D-III in football? Or, do these schools not give scholarships at all, and just choose to participate at that level because they want to, or because they have a conference affiliation that demands that? There is “No” D-IAA in any other sport than football, so i was just curious. Any thoughts?
“But a Division III school beating a non-scholarship I-AA school is not unheard of.”
—-
Or occasionally beat a d-1aa scholarship team … re: UWLX over South Dakota State last season.
vhwon Says:
November 14th, 2007 at 12:19 am
To think that UMHB is the Redskins of Div III is just plain nonsense. Perhaps the Cowboys-Patriots game is a slightly better analogy.
vhwon,
I was not insinuating that UMHB is the Redskins of D3. The point I was making is that after watching that football game, a rematch may be closer, but UMHB would be very unlikely to win. Were you there? The UWW dominated the line of scrimmage on both sides of tha ball. That is what forced the turnovers. UMHB could play it smarter (they made some of the stupidest penalties I’ve ever witnessed. Including jumping offsides again and again in crucial situations) and cleaner (6 turnovers). However, when a team is mismatched in the trenches, a football game is very hard to win.
I’m assuming UMHB would not play stupid football again. I’m assumic their qb won’t panic like he did the last time around. And I’m still seeing UWW winning. If they play again, and UMHB wins, I will be the first to get on here and admit I was wrong. But when I read an opinion that the result would be “different”, I have to ask myself a couple of questions. Was that person even at the game? What is their definition of “different”?
Mainjack, the NCAA does not permit a school to be a separate classification from D-III except for those few sports where they have been “grandfathered”, e.g., Johns Hopkins Lacrosse or Colorado College Men’s Ice Hockey.
Ye, they have chosen to give athetics scholarshhips in other sports, but not football.
bleedpurple,
I can not answer for the original posting that prompted your Redskins comparison. I was not physically at the game, but I did watch the game live on the internet. The game was determined by turnovers and stupid penalties by UMHB. Honestly, UWW did not win that game as much as UMHB lost it. No excuses for the Cru, but they played a very bad game. UWW came to play, UMHB looked tired from the flight the previous day. They seem to abandon all what was winning games before. They passed the ball way too much. I know I am playing Monday morning quarterback here (weeks later), but seriously aren’t we all doing just that with our postings.
Thanks Ralph
jlawrence01 – Your post earlier this morning…….paragraphs 4 & 5 were spot on. I’ve never heard it synthesized quite like that but you are 99.99999% correct!!
re: Div I-aa vs Div III.
Ursinsus ( Centennial Conference) has beaten LaSalle I-AA 4 yrs in a row.
But LaSalle is a very week team in Phila- Home of the power House(haha) Temple.
“MUC honestly is not competing with the Earlhams and the Oberlins for football players.”
That is probably a correct statement 99% of the time. Of course, neither is Capital, Ohio Northern, Baldwin-Wallace or John Carroll.
While you guys sitting on the outside find whatever you can to bash what Mount Union has done, I would like to point out a couple things.
First, Mount Union is not the only D3 football team to have 150 kids on its roster. Some schools have limits as do some conferences. For instance the OAC has rules for recruiting that are tougher than the D3 rules, meaning if an OAC school wants a kid that is also being looked at by a Washington & Jeffereson or Wittenberg, for example, they can not do some of the things those schools can do.
Second, I hope you do realize that it is easier and less expensive to manage a roster of 80 or 100 than 150. Mount Union does not lie to any kid. They know where they stand. Do kids transfer? Yes, but here again, the OAC has rules that are tougher than D3, so typically when an OAC kid transfers, he does so to a school outside the conference.
Anyway, Mount Union has a no cut rule. Anyone that wants to put in the effort makes the team and dresses for regular season home games. If you think Mount Union throws 150 kids against the wall with the hopes 22 stud football players stick you are not giving the program its due. I am not saying you think that, just making that statement. Mount Union, and the kid, knows his chances of ever playing. So if a kid wants to be a part of Mount Union football, knowing he will never get on the field, who is anyone else to say that is a bad thing.
I assure you the big roster is a difficult thing in many ways. They lose kids every year in the recruiting process, including a stud linebacker that turned out to be All-OAC for another school as an example, for the sole reason that some kids are overwhelmed by the size of the roster and don’t think they’ll ever get the chance to play. So I think the no cut rule is admorable when it would be much easier to not have it. But again, it is a point of target for a program that doesn’t have many. Just like transfers used to be. But if you listed the stud D1 football players that transfered to an OAC school in order of how much they contributed to their new team, you would be down the list before you get a Purple Raider. So now we move on to the roster size.
I believe it was mandated a few years ago that DI schools had to have football at the DI-aa level. That’s why Georgetown and UConn and poor LaSalle have football programs
PA_wesleyfan :
UCONN isn’t too unhappy with their football team now !! And they’re not D-1AA anymore !!
If I recall correctly, the difference between I-A and I-AA is not just scholarships, it is also the size of the attendance at the games. I-A schools must average 15,000 in home attendance and offer a minimum number of scholarships. I-AA schools do not have either of these requirements.
I should also note that I-AA schools may give scholarships if they wish. It’s just that it is not required like it is in I-A.