Ahh, the flood has already begun. People like to complain about All-Region selections but usually they don’t stop to consider the process.
For example:
I am infuriated on your all region picks on the running backs Xxx Xxxxxxxxxxxx from xxxxx has an average of 5.5 per carry 12 touchdowns a total of 1,285 yards. How can your pick Xxxxxx and these other running backs over Xxxxxxxxxxxx this is disgusting and so unfair is this done for political reasons. This is my son I’m his mother … I’m disgusted and upset you people are horrible and to top it off he’s a senior. He helped xxxxxx get to the playoffs I didn’t see Xxxxxx do that or the others. This is obviously fixed. I will make an issue of this you people are awful and phonies
Her son wasn’t actually nominated. Hard to get on the team that way. He also wasn’t first team All-Conference and often that weighs into the decision whether to nominate a player.
I also had a situation this year where a player that had gotten accolades in the past was not nominated. I went back to the school and they said the coaching staff felt he had not played at an All-Region level this season.
I had to respect that — but also in looking at the other players nominated in that region at that spot, I had to put that person on the ballot.
The process starts shortly after the season ends. In this instance, schools had an eight-day window in which to nominate their players. On that eighth day, I looked through the nominees and specifically targeted 30 schools that hadn’t nominated players. Anyone who responded to the e-mail and needed an extension got an extra 24 hours.
In the end, sure, there are even worthy players who were nominated and just didn’t get enough votes. I understand that. We try to be perfect but I doubt we ever will be.
For that I apologize. We’ll continue to try to get better.
Pat…thank you for all that you do…anyone who complains is either an overzelaous parent or a moron
While looking at the various teams, I began to wonder if a DIII All-Star game (North/East vs. West/South) after the Stagg Bowl would generate any interest. I suspect the current arrangement with the Aztec Bowl might preclude its happening right away, but would it not be feasible upon the expiration of the contract (I assume there is one?) with the NCAA and their Mexican counterparts? I’d be curious to know what the D3football.com staff, as well as fans in general, think of the idea. Perhaps the idea has been floated before…..just wondering.
This is a cool idea and I would hope it would happen someday.
I suspect it might be do-able anyway, though we would need the AFCA’s support and funding and while I’m sure they would support the concept, I’m not sure they could fund a second All-Star experience at the D-III level.
While we could probably help organize and stage a game, we wouldn’t be able to provide much funding. Some, perhaps, which is more than in previous years, but not much.
Perhaps a grass-roots lobby effort directed towards the AFCA (email/snail mail campaign, etc)? I’d be willing to participate in any way I can.
I’m sure this Mother loves her son, however as a former college athlete, I would be mortified if my “mommy” complained on a national Website as to my missing accolades. It is unfortunate that this mother can’t grasp that her son has already proven himself as a winner simply by participating and contributing for his school. Less than 2% of all college students have the opportunity, or the “ability” for that matter to contribute. Hail to all D3 schools for expanding that unique opportunity!
Shame on Mrs. Xxxxxxxxxxxx.
Her son had a great year, yes. But #1, you can’t penalize a player when it comes to awards and honors because he isn’t on a good team. And #2, the stats aren’t actually in Mr. Xxxxxxxxxxxx’s favor.
National rushing rankings:
No. 6 – Tom Arcidiacono (All-East 1st Team)
No. 11 – Matt Bielecki (All-East 2nd Team)
No. 22 – Mark Robinson (All-East 1st Team)
No. 25 – Khalee Prothro (All-East 2nd Team)
No. 28 – Gennaro Leo (All-East 3rd Team)
No. 30 – Jay Bernardo (All-East 3rd Team)
No. 32 – Xxx Xxxxxxxxxxxx
You should be happy with what Xxxxxx accomplished this year as a team.
per review of daily dose archives, noted that in past you kindly provided at list of schools and number of players these schools nominated for All Region. Would it be possible for you to do this again at some point?
Although I was not surprised there were no Hobart players on the East 1st teams – our offense performed below expectations and most of our defense was inexperienced, but I have to say I was surprised not to find Evan Hoffman anywhere on the list.
Hoffman had as good (lead Statesmen in tackles and made several big plays including forcing and recovering a fumble in the Rowan game that gave Bart a chance to get back in the game), if not a better season than Purdie.
Not a big deal – I know not everyone can squeeze into the list and that there are a lot of deserving kids. Just felt this, IMO, was an omission that merited mentioning.
BTW – I realize Purdie is a DE and Hoffman a LB.
Find it interesting that the LL defensive player of the year was a LB on the 3rd team. Perception (and/or reality) could be that there is not as many good LBs in the LL as the E8, NJAC and other East leagues…..
I put this in just to stir up some discussion and not to be critical of the people who select the all-region teams who have a very difficult job. Earlier today I posted this message on the E-8 site:
“Took a look at the All-East team. While I am sure that there will be a number of folks that believe some players should have made the team that were left off, I generally think the SID’s did a reasonable job at selecting the three teams.
The one question I have is the selection of Mark Robinson as the East’s Offensive Player of the Year. Don’t get me wrong. Robinson is a great football player, but I am not quite sure how you can select Robinson over a guy that turns around Springfield’s program this year and leads the nation in rushing and scoring by wide margins.
Without Robinson, SJF is a very good football team that still may be heading to Mt Union this weekend. Without Chris Sharpe, Springfield is an average team and doesn’t even make the playoffs.”
I would also add these stats and NCAA rankings to the discussion;
MARK ROBINSON: 13 games (12-1), 1460 yds rushing, 112.3 ypg (22nd), 23 td’s, 10.6 ppg (8th)
CHRIS SHARPE: 12 games (10-2), 1941 yds rushing, 161.8 ypg (1st), 35 td’s, 17.7 ppg (1st). The most impressive stat of all for Chris Sharpe/Springfield in my opinion, that has not received much notoriety, is that they led the nation in turnover ratio at +1.9 per game. That is an amazing statistic for a triple option attack that is historically prone to turning the ball over. With the QB having to make good decisions and execute on just about every play, Springfield committed only 11 fumbles and 2 int’s all season.
I am not a SJF or Springfield supporter, but having followed eastern football all season, I do feel that Sharpe did more for his team then any other player in the East.
Disagreement is both anticipated and welcomed.
I am a little surprised that none of Wesley’s D backs made the team. Though I suspect it had as much to do with the way the front seven played this year. So there stats were probably down tackle wise. But Swann and Harris certainly are deserving. The one that surpirses me most though is Catanea the kicker. He was 12 for 15 and all his misses were over 40 with one being 50. He also kicks the ball deep every time. But this is one man’s opinion and I completely understand how it works the allstar stuff works.
Catanea is phenomenal. Part of one of the best kicking duos i have ever seen in college.
Shame on Kid:
I actually agree with you on both points, however in this case Mr. Xxxxxxxx was not No.32 in rushing and was actually higher than 4 others you mentioned.
Also I agree with anyone that thinks that All anything teams are just BS it really doesn’t matter if you make it or don’t, because its just opinions of specific people and not the general consensus.
I think it is also a shame in all Divs and in High School, that SIDs/Coaches/Editors lobby for specific players to make these teams, when it was traditional based on a players performance.
Finally, i think the way you explained it Pat of how you guys select these players is somewhat odd. Unless it was the way the comment was worded, and i just miss read it. IE Div-1 big ten Troy Smith 1st team and Quinn 2nd team, or a coach not liking a player, thus not nominating him. Thus you bypass around 3/4 of the players automatically that start, and have a chance of being a good player. I am sure there is more to the equation, but from what you explained thats what i got out of it.
wow…feel bad for the player…not making the all region team and then having momma come on and bash him…can we give him a special award because I trully feel his pain right now
I want to thank all of D3Football staff for putting in the time & effort to create the D3 football all-region teams … It was very gratifying to see my son & two of his Menlo teammates on the All-West team.
My son was ecstatic and speechless. He had played 80% of the season with a high-ankle sprain that limited his pass rushing, especially the Linfield game where the best tackle in D3, Rob McCullough, tossed him around.
What I was interested in, was the process. You compiled a list by position of submitted players and then had different coaches/sports information folks for each college vote on them ? How many schools in each region ?
Just wondering how everything worked ???
Thanks again for the excellent publication, my 2nd year, and all the hard work to make this a quality publication !!
Pat,
Was JR Harriel from Greenville College nominated for North all region team? It is hard to believe that the LB of the Year in that conference and #1 in 4 defensive catergories doesn’t make the team but another LB from that conference does. Maybe JR didn’t deserve to make the team but if any LB from IBFC was going to make it, it should have been him.
“I actually agree with you on both points, however in this case Mr. Xxxxxxxx was not No.32 in rushing and was actually higher than 4 others you mentioned.”
Then why didn’t he make first team All-Conference? Shouldn’t the opinion of the coaches that see him in person and on video count for something?
Prothro made first team All-MAC. So did Juniata’s running back. But not Mr. Xxxxxxxxxxxxx.
genius: No nominations from Greenville.
mather: Schools submitted players with their stats. The committee (one person picked from every conference plus our regional writers and national crew) sees every nominated player in their region and votes on the top four to six at that spot.
WUMAC: Not really sure what you’re getting at. I’m not sure it’s a matter of a coach liking the guy (and is that true that a coach only likes a quarter of his players? yikes!). It’s a matter of a guy being deserving.
Some schools nominated a couple. Some nominated 10-12 … and risked splitting the potential vote among their players.
I’ll be able to provide a list but I don’t have that database query (geek talk) handy.
“Then why didn’t he make first team All-Conference? Shouldn’t the opinion of the coaches that see him in person and on video count for something?”
I dunno should it? I mean if you take a look at the stats:
Prothro: Att: 190 Yds: 996 Avg: 5.2 TD: 5
Ehredt: Att: 187 Yds: 915 Avg: 4.8 TD: 10
Mr. X Att: 235 Yds: 1285 Avg: 5.5 TD: 12
I guess the opinion of the coaches does not key on stats it just keys on personal opinion of what they think of the player. However stats talk and coaches don’t.
“It’s a matter of a guy being deserving.”
Thats the problem with all anything teams, because how do you grade deserving, how do you tell these coaches who nominate and vote that here is the set criteria and how to pick. You cant its all personal opinion and politics, from getting nominated to getting votes. For that reason there will be players who are good and our left out.
Pat- “I’m not sure it’s a matter of a coach liking the guy (and is that true that a coach only likes a quarter of his players? yikes!)”
No i was commenting on how you explained the two selection criteria , in the beginning of the post. I was saying that if you only go by Nominations and First Team players, then you skip about 3/4 of the starters that play in D3. I am sure that there must be more criteria for coming up with the original list of players, to vote for so obviously i cannot say for sure what i think about the system.
Dunno what to tell you, man. Talk to the MAC coaches. I don’t know why we are involved in this discussion.
BTW, I kept the discussion as anonymous as possible. I’m not sure your listing the kid’s stats are the right way to go. You’ve essentially outed him and his mom and I’m not overly thrilled with that.
You already outed him by telling the Conf other players, and then exactly putting the amount of X’s in the things you deleted thus using the stats the mom gave it was pretty simple to figure it out.
You gave the stats not me in the Beg. then again my name was a give away too…
Putting in the amount of X’s? Only if you know what the name is, does that help. 🙂
Well it helps once you give out the stats and other players in the Conf.
Not sure what all the “to do” is about this. All conference has always been and most likely always will be at least partly political. You can refine the criteria all you want but I’m not sure it is possible to make it totally unbiased. I know a guy from a long time ago and a land far…far away that made 2nd team all conference. He had the stats to be first team but he played on a team with a losing record. Life goes on. Bet if he had gotten his mama involved, he would have been conference player of the year. 🙂
WUMAC,
Umm, not sure what stats you’re going by. I went by the average rushing yards per game rankings provided by the NCAA at NCAAsports.com through last week.
Go there and look at No. 32. Make sure we’re talking about the same guy. Four spots higher is Gennaro Leo, who actually made All-Region.
Shoot, how about we be fair to the voters of the All-Conference team in the MAC, who voted on their teams with just regular season stats. In that case, this is what Mr. Xxxxxxxxxxxxx had before the playoffs:
104.6 yards per game (1,046 total), 5.3 ypc, 9 TDs. All six RBs who made All-Region are still ranked above him after just the regular season when it comes to NCAA’s rushing yards per game ranking.
Lets be frank here and admit it was Xxxxxx’s defense that carried them into the playoffs. They allowed only 8.3 points a game in the regular season.
They got three defensive players of the All-East first team. That’s more than Rowan and Cortland State, two equally as good defenses. Now how, going back to what Mrs. Xxxxxxxxxxxxx said, is that “political.”
Admit it WUMAC, Mrs. Xxxxxxxxxxxxx’s email was ridiculous. I certainly hope Pat will post her apology on here soon.
It may be that the player with the better stats did not make first team because of non-stat items that his coach and the other coaches see. By this I mean such things as blocking when he does not have the ball or carrying out fakes when others are going to get the ball.
Stat readers never see those things, but coaches do. Honors should go to the team player, not the “only me” player.
Allsky 7 “All conference has always been and most likely always will be at least partly political. You can refine the criteria all you want but I’m not sure it is possible to make it totally unbiased. I know a guy from a long time ago and a land far…far away that made 2nd team all conference. He had the stats to be first team but he played on a team with a losing record. ”
Too true about All Conference politics and bias. Know a freshman player, #1 in conference and #1 in state in his spot, national rank in the 30’s. Insulted with an honorable mention in All conference!
I’am a little biased, but have to agree that Chris Sharpe should have been a run-away winner of Offensive Player of the year award. These were not just East-leading stats but NATIONAL . #1 in TD’s and rushing says it all.
At least Mr Xxxxx Got to play.My Momma Didn’t want me to play the foolsball I had to sneak behind her back.Mrs x says to top it off he’s a senior, poor guy. Mommy x your behavior should have change before High School,the only appologizing should be you to your son. I happen to hate all these types of awards there often wrong and always leave some one out.If you need your name on a list to know your good get off the field.
I agree 100% with Brandon.
All-Conference can be political, coaches can play favorites or bargain ‘you give me this guy, I’ll give you that’ … but I highly doubt it’s 100% politics. Some of it has to be merit-based, at least going by expert opinion (by that I mean coaches)
Coaches are a very good source of expertise on this for a couple reasons. One, the player’s own coach has seen how that player carries himself in practice, with the team, in the offseason and in doing the little things required of him, whatever position he plays. Those things may or may not be relevant to all-region (I think they are) and if you’re a coaches’ favorite (I was not, but I see why the people who were are) you’ve most likely done something to earn it.
On the flipside, there are no coaches favorites when it comes to opposing coaches, who also have a big say in it. They usually have 6-8 games to look at between them to judge whether a player was consistently dominant … not just good, mind you, dominant.
All-Conference is a good place to start. If you’re not at least on second team all-Conference, very unlikely you’ll be first-team all-Region … but you can still be nominated if you aren’t all-Conference, and our staff will take a look at it and make their own decisions.
It’s very rare that a parent of a player has anything resembling an unbiased perspective about his or her son’s play. Parents are in love with their own children, and they should be. They often not only don’t see them for what they are, but they don’t even care to look at the competition that’s out their. Parents can be very son-centric, naturally. You can almost not expect them to be reasonable.
Stats are not the end-all be-all of awards, and I’m glad D3football’s honors don’t necessarily go to the QB who threw for the most yards (often that’s also the QB that threw the most passes) … team talent, team balance and scheme factor into stats, which sometimes tell the story, and often don’t.
Politics can be a factor in any group of accolades, and awards are subjective by nature. However, having been an all-region voter in the past (I did not do it this year), I know how time-consuming it is. It LITERALLY TAKES HOURS to do a region, to pore over the stats of several nominees in each category and then pare it down to your top three, and then for Pat to compile the votes on the back end.
For people to dismiss it as just politics is hugely disrepectful to the amount of time the all-region voters put into it, without any compensation for their time. They do it strictly for the honor it brings to the youngsters, and to ensure the All-Region teams are legitimate honors (as opposed to lists of 187 All-Americans who are named such because they play in America).
Instead of losing your cool because of your own personal wants, desires and biases, you should be thanking these voters for giving two craps about your son and his season … if you haven’t noticed, few other media outlets do.
But that’s just my opinion 🙂
Just a brief note to all of the Mount Union fans and WWhitewater fans. Both great programs and great coaches. But all of Mount Union nation had to be relieved when the Warhawks beat St. John’s in the semi-finals. Thank God MUC didn’t have to face John Gagliardi and defensive coordinator Jerry Haugen again. Remember 2003!!??
labart when you wake up from your nap (coma) maybe you will realize Mount Union did not play a great first half, as you mentioned a couple times. For someone that has been around the game as long as you claim you certainly should know there are missed opportunities in every game and you certainly have tunnel vision for mentioning UWW’s and ignoring the fact Mount union fumbled the ball inside UWW’s 25 on its first drive and allowed a kickoff return to the four-yard line for UWW’s only touchdown. By your very, very ignorant logic it could (should) have been 21-6 at halftime. Man, sorry dude but I just call them like I see them. And what I see is a guy that lacks enough focus to actually see what happens in a game. Either that or your you are so biased you are unable to see it.
sju sorry but LK wants Gags one more time in the worst way I hope you do know that and were just trying to be funny. After all it is 3-1 overall Purple with one game being a 50 point win and the other game 35-0 until Gag’s team scored two, timeout aided touchdowns in the final five minutes.
sju but I don’t want to come across the wrong way I think the Raider nation would agree SJU’s gameplan in ’03 was the best they faced in a long, long time and there is the utmost respect for the job the coaching staff does there. They are very, very solid.
Now back to my purple coolaid.