Alright, well, I’ve had the bracket in my hands for almost five hours so I’ve probably come to grips with it, but you guys haven’t had it nearly as long so it’s time to let out those pent-up frustrations.
I would really like to get to the bottom of the Millsaps mileage issue. The folks on the committee told me that the number they got was higher than 500 miles, so I’d like to know what it takes to standardize these distances. There’s a Web site the NCAA mandates schools to use to determine whether a game is in-region and that is indeed the site I used. Why they got different numbers, neither of us is sure.
In the end, it just means we have a regional semifinal one week early.
Looking forward to the potential matchup of Rowan and Wilkes in the second round. That should be a great game. Rowan is just getting its offense in gear and I’m not sure that Hobart, which struggled with William Paterson and others, can keep up. Wilkes is strong on defense as well. I haven’t seen the field since September, so I wonder what it looks like now.
Springfield, as I mentioned on the air, is in shape to play two games on turf, which bodes well for their offense. They need a lower seed to advance out of the other half of the bracket so they can continue to host on turf. They would get that if Rowan were to beat Wilkes, but I also doubt the Springfield/St. John Fisher potential rematch in round two would replicate round one. Springfield will still be favored but that doesn’t mean the game will be the same.
Can anyone aside from Capital hang with Mount Union in the top bracket? Can Capital even do it?
Kind of a neat story to get two long-time playoff drought teams together in round one in Pittsburgh. Contrast in styles, too.
West, two storied programs meet in the first round in Pella, while Bethel tries again to get the first-round monkey off its back.
Floor open for your thoughts.
I play football in the ASC and i think it is a shame for UMHB to have to play HS in the first round. We also played Millsaps this year and stomped all over them. I think it is totally unfair to allow Millsaps to dodge the bullet of playing UMHB, especially when Millsaps lacks the same caliber of UMHB. We lost to both UMHB and HS and I can personally say that Millsaps really and truly screws up this years bracket, because they wont even be it in for long, especially if they to play either HS or UMHB at any point.
I have to agree with snackwell’s post, Hardin Simmons has a great shot at being in the final four. First game first though, you have to go through the cru. The game between hsu and umhb earilier in the season was a toss up the whole game. It could’ve went either way. A couple of costly mistakes by the cowboys was very crucial at times. But sat. is a new game and I believe the COWBOYS are ready. They outscored their opponets 231-74 in the past 5 games. They’ve exploded ever since their lose to umhb. Coach Keeling is going to have his boys ready and so it Coach Fredenberg. I believe its going to come down to execution. It’s that simple, whoever makes the least mistakes is going to win. I believe with the revenge hsu wants on umhb and the fire they have about themselves now, nothing will stop them, maybe not even Mount Union. Aside from the game, i do think that the ACS did get the short end of the stick from the NCAA. Even though we all knew that hsu-umhb would probably meet up in the 2 round, they shouldn’t have to play each other during the first round. But the bottom line is they were most likely gonna play each other anyways, so it’s here, lets let it happen and see what happens. They bring theirs we’ll bring ours……bottom line. Prediction- HSU by 14. GO COWBOYS!!!!!!
jdex,
If you noticed in my post I took ownership of cancelling the series. As I said, at the time we couldnt compete and a very young program was in grave trouble. When you suffer consecutive losses of 63-0 and 71-0 (last game of the 90′ season and first game of 91′ season) and are fielding a team of 35-40 guys it’s pretty easy to figure out what games you need to get off your schedule in order to survive. At the time we were making national news for a losing streak and games without scoring a point. To the credit of the program and the guys that were there we hung in and helped form the building blocks of a program that today is not just “respectable” but one of the finest in Upstate. As I said earlier I would love to see the two schools renew the series, somehow i think the days of 71-0 are very far behind us. In fact if I remember correctly the last meeting was an ECAC playoff game and our “repspectable” program put it to you.
Snackwell just remember Whitewater played that game predominantly with their third and fourth string running backs…..that won’t be the case if we meet you or MHB. Hope to see you in December so we can POUND THE ROCK……
Did you play the game with your third and fourth string o-linemen, too, Sakman? Or are you just trying to keep THOSE kids from getting thrown under the bus?
Union;
I think the LL gets about the right amount of respect. It is a good league, but not one of top 3-4 in the land. The E8 is certainly the best conference in the east this season.
I think the upstate teams as a group are underrated sometimes, but as Cortland football and others have said, it may be partly their own fault because the are scattered all over the landscape in 4-5 different leagues.
I think SJF is likely the best team in the Wilkes bracket and will be a good Union team in a close game. Marotti will have to play better than he did last week if the Dutchman want to hang with Fisher.
JP don’t know what you are saying…..I assume you mean are Oline is not that good …..I believe if we meet the results will be different….
Snackwell,
Who cares how many yards UW Whitewater had in that game against Mary Hardin-Baylor – THEY WON AGAINST A GREAT TEAM. You failed to mention the 98 yard kick return for a TD by UWW (it may have been an 89 yarder).
Hey, at least the two schools play a tough non-confernce schedule – unlike many colleges. I have Mary Hardin-Baylor going to the final four. They are very good, and play a very, very tough schedule.
I have UW Whitewater winning it all.
“We also played Millsaps this year and stomped all over them. I think it is totally unfair to allow Millsaps to dodge the bullet of playing UMHB, especially when Millsaps lacks the same caliber of UMHB.”
What, is UMHB a .45 and Millsaps a .22? 🙂
Funny thing about comparing teams you meet at different points in the season: it just doesn’t work sometimes. Millsaps installed a new coach, new schemes, new everything. As a result they weren’t terribly competitive at first. I presume you played for MC since that’s the only ASC team to “stomp” Millsaps. Don’t blame Millsaps for “screwing up the bracket” – blame the NCAA. All the Majors did was secure their first D3 playoff bid ever.
I guess UMHB might as well hang it up because they lost in their first game, too. The Majors probably aren’t going to be beating anyone as good as UMHB or HSU, but they are a whole lot better now than when you played them.
Thanks Ron, My sentiments exactly! I think the Majors would be as happy to travel to Belton as they would Pittsburgh, making the playoffs was a huge hurdle for them to overcome!
Hey OU –
When Rutgers beats Ohio State in the BCS Championship, you’ll be singing a different tune. 🙂 Seriously though – the computer rating systems have their place. They are great for measuring the power of teams which the voters don’t get to see play often (or ever). They are also completely objective, which you cannot say about voters.
But if you are asking me if I think they can out-guess a human who knows his football, the answer is no. I doubt it. Use the ratings as a tool, not as the final answer.
SJF –
Your E10 league sounds great to me. However the teams which encompass the E10 do not agree. As I understand it Cortland tried to get into the E10. The story is all teams voted “no” except 1 team – Ithaca.
Didn’t this whole argument play itself out a few weeks ago?
Sackman, that’s not what I’m suggesting. What I AM suggesting is that you seem pretty quick to pin the low yardage output on the third and fourth string running backs, as opposed to say, the O-line. Didn’t they have something to do with the low yardage output? Of course they did, and the reason is the UMHB defensive front seven. They’re fast and physical–as fast and physical as I’ve personally ever seen at the DIII level, and that’s at least 15 years worth of football observation.
I just stopped in to see what people were talking about today!
And I can’t believe that someone at 9:18 am was still talking about Cortland not gettin in because of Hobart. Dude you just got to give it up! Hobart has absolutly nothing to do with Cortland not getting in!!!!!!
I feel for you going 9-1 and not getting in! But what does Hobart’s win loss record and some meaningless pre-season scrimmage have to do with it?
How many Hobart games did you see this season?
SJFC1993:
42 good to hear from ya…you going to be at the game Sat?
I remember that number (42) well.
Mr. Jafo I’ll go on at 5:15 and say cortland should be in and Hobart out Cortlands level of play was miles above Hobart’s.Just not right never surrender your true feeling, beat that dead horse wrong is wrong
jpbower,
If Mary Hardin-Baylor’s defensive line is as good as you say it is (and it is), what do you have to say about UW Whitewater’s defense who held MHB to only a field goal?
Two great teams.
Agreed, Sean–two great teams.
I would also say that the UMHB defense is definitively the strength of the Crusader team. They’ve consistently been able to put the UMHB offense in short-field positions that have allowed them to be successful.
And while I know that you “get” this, my earlier point was that it isn’t any more fair to pin the low offensive output by the Warhawks in the UMHB game on the substitute RB’s than it is the first team OLs–they were playing against an outstanding group of playmakers on the other side.
Not blaming the running backs and I believe our oline will tell you that they played poorly and MHB has a great defense and played well but it would have been a different game with Beaver and we hope to prove that in December…..
jpbower and Sakman,
I think you are both right. UW Whitewater could have scored a ton of points if Mary Hardin-Baylor’s defensive line wasn’t so good. AND, Beaver would have run better than the back-ups – how much, who knows?
I hope they meet in the playoffs because that is the way I have it in my Pick ’em pool. I do have UW Whitwater winning it all.
Other than the CCIW teams Wheaton and North Central, and UWW, I would like to see Mary Hardin-Baylor or Hardin Simmons take it due to the fact that their conference got jipped by having two of the best teams in the country forced to play each other in the first round of the playoffs.
sean GOP, thanks for some unbiased support of our texas “whining” about the brackets. I really do hope the winner of UMHB/HSU Saturday goes a very long way(SALEM?) to show why this first round pairing–WHICH COULD HAVE BEEN AVOIDED USING THE ncaa’s OWN CRITERIA–was so wrong.
sjff82,
Unfortunately I’ve got commitments the next 2 weekends so I’m going to be hoping for a trip to the semis so I can catch a game in person.
Cortland,
Thanks for the info on the E10 idea. I’m disappointed but not suprised to hear about the all but unanimous “no” vote. I would have hoped that SJFC would have cast a “yes”. Do you know when it was last proposed and voted on?
SJFC1993-
No I do not. JDex might have more insight than I on this.
How many Fisher games have you seen this season? The way they keep putting out running backs who are unstoppable makes me think their success has more to do with their offensive line than people are giving them credit for.
In my experience it is rare to see that many top flight backs in one program over several years. It usually is more attributable to a big, physical line.
SJFC,
CortlandFoptball has it right. Knowing a new conference was in the wind, Corts had feelers out. Response was negative, but for IC. So it was, NJAC here we come. That was what, about the turn of the century, we believe.
You sure did do an ECAC number on Cortland. No doubt you’ve come a long way. Fisher wanted football and made it happen. Best of luck this weekend. Go far!
TO: UNIONFOOTBALL5 WITH ALL DUE RESPECT TO A GREAT RUNNINGBACK (TOM A) THE BEST RUNNINGBACK IN THE COUNTRY IS A QUATERBACK! AND I THINK YOUR TEAM ALREADY FOUND THAT OUT. GOOD LUCK ON SAT.
Justin Beaver does not play quarterback. 🙂
Ypsi,
I agree that two baffling things occurred in the Texas matchup, the no rematches rule and the mileage thing. But the Texas and West Coast subbrackets trump all.
I have some strong opinions about it in the ATN that will be up in the next few hours, but think of it like this: If the bracket had been matched according to seeds, HSU-UMHB is a second-round game anyway. It’s not like they would have had a chance to meet in the final four or anything. And this way, you’re guaranteed a second-round rep.
(Bowerman, you said someone has to lose this weekend. Who’s to say they were both going to win with a different draws. Texas has shown it can play, but CNU proved they aren’t in a league of their own)
CF
“3. Hardin-Simmons (I know you disagree with this one Keith)”
Yeah, I still do. 🙂
Here’s what I haven’t heard yet amid the Pool C bickering. If you take Cortland, who do you boot?
Capital? In.
Hardin-Simmons? In.
Hobart and SJF had the cred. Multiple games against 6-, 7- and 8-win teams. They’re in.
UW-La Crosse caught the beatdown by Whitewater, but beat a scholarship I-AA that’s 7-3. In.
Now you’re looking at Wheaton, St. John’s and Cortland.
Wheaton beat a 5-win team, three 6-win teams and an 8-win team, losing by an FG to Augustana. In.
St. John’s lost by two scores to its conference champ, Bethel, who had a funny 3-point loss to Carleton, a middle of the pack MIAC team.
Cortland lost by one score in OT to its conference champ, Rowan, who had a funny OT loss to Montclair State, a middle of the pack NJAC team.
The Johnnies played UW-Eau Claire, who usually is a challenge and ends up with a much better record.
The Red Dragons played Brockport State, who usually is a challenge and ends up with a much better record.
St. John’s and Cortland’s credentials are basically one and the same.
Only one of them could go. The other five had them on cred, and UW-La Crosse had the I-AA win. It would stink if Olaf sneaking into the regional rankings and Ithaca dropping out because Cortland beat them was the killer, but otherwise …
No matter what the committee did at this point, they were going to get a uproarious reaction.
Justin WHO ? lol
D3Keith,
Good insight man. Bingo on Wheaton – they are good. Had Augustana had an average kicker, they may have won the only game they lost.
GO CCIW! GO WIAC! GO MHB AND HS! (Oh, and Springfield, and unfortunately Mounty Union).
SeanGOP
What…..are you running for office. The elections ended a week ago. Please don’t tell me we will be seeing your ads on TV from now until next November. LOL.
You might want to rethink you bracket.
Cortland,
I’ve only had a chance to catch one game in person this year but I keep in touch with the staff there on a pretty regular basis.
I think the success of the running game is a combination of the two. Over the past few seasons they have had Myers, Robinson, and Reile all sharing time at one point or another. Each of those backs have put up impressive numbers and played to all-america standards. No doubt the O-line doesn’t get enough credit. They are basically a bunch of no name guys that just keeping getting the job done. Some of that credit needs to go to the O-line coach and the offensive scheme they run. The O-line coach has been there 16 years and they’ve been working that spread hybrid offense for about 10 years. You do the same thing over and over again and eventually you get real good at it…
The question mark in my mind going into Saturday is defense. I’m hoping there isn’t a repeat of the Springfield effort. Defense has cost them over the last few years. They blew a lead to Del Val in the 2nd round a couple of years back and didn’t show up at all last year when they needed a win to get in versus Alfred. I think this team will go as far as their defense allows them to go. I havent seen their offense shut down in quite some time so I have no reason to think anyone will shut them down in the playoffs.
Jdeg, thanks for the well wishes. I hope they do go far and I hope someday that the Red Dragons and the Cardinals start to meet on a regular basis again.
Keith,
True about the number of wins that Wheaton’s opponent had, but that non-conference schedule was very weak: three wins against teams from conferences that are a combined O-for-the playoffs. The CCIW’s overall records are good because they are surrounded by soft conferences and most apparently would rather schedule NC games against the MIIA and the IBC than the WIAC (which SJU scheduled twice).
While not part of the selection formula directly, it at least adds context. I’m not saying Wheaton shouldn’t be in . . . I’m just suggesting there’s not that big of gap between them and SJU and Cortland (which I am now spelling without the U).
And a great ATN this week. Thanks.
I musta missed out somewhere about any conversation regarding how long Whitworth has been absent from the playoffs. The current poll for “…longtime playoff droughts…” doesn’t include Whitworth. Haven’t they been waiting awhile as well?
Raiderguy,
No, I’m not running for office, but if I was I would hope I would be running against you – I’d win in a landslide.
My final four are: UW Whitewater (who will dominate the toughest bracket by far), Springfield, Mary Hardin-Baylor, and unfortunately your team – Mount Union.
Sorry you get upset that I support more than one team. Has your team won four in a row yet? What? I’m sorry, I couldn’t hear you – it sounded like you said, “NO”.
What does your Ohio wisdom tell you about the final four (and to answer a question you are probably thinking about now, you can’t pick Mount Union four times).
Four – that’s a good number. It reminds me of the Four consecutive National Championships Augustanta won. yes, I know it was in the 80’s, but a record is a record.
I must say I am impressed by the rabid reaction of the Cortland fans to their snub by the Slection Committee. While Franklin fan certainly has not “represented” as well as Cortland fan, let me say we are equally dismayed at the fact that the Grizzlies were snubbed as well. Clearly there are more than 32 teams that deserve the opportunity to extend their seasons with a playoff birth. How can a team go 9-1, lose their one game to an undefeated team by a touchdown on a very very controversial 4th down interference call, and not get a chance to move on? I understand that all of Division III sports for all of the Division III schools is financed with an allocated sum of the CBS Div. I basketball contract that equals 3.18%…..not just to finance football, but all of Division III sports….men and women’s programs……I understand that Div. I basketball is the cash cow, but the NCAA is supposed to be about all atheletics for all collegiate participants…..Division I added one more week to the season beginning this year….why couldn’t there be a series of maybe 3 or 4 regional mini bowls the first weeknd that were seeded that would serve as play in opportunities for teams like Cortland and Franklin who had one loss seasons and are sitting home for their effort. I haven’t seen Cortland play….obviously they had a great season and are very talented, but as a long time football fan I promise you Franklin is a very high powered well balanced team that deserved a chance to showcase their talent. 9 and 1 seasons are hard to come by and those that achieve this kind of record should have something more than a “sorry ’bout that” from the NCAA……money can’t be the issue. How long ago did March Madness grow to 64 teams? They did because they had to…..Division III shouldn’t be so set in their ways….if this is truly about the athletes, have the NCAA step up and prove it. Franklin’s coach was very classy about the snub, addressing his players and the school’s Touchdown Club, he said the way to fix it is to simply go 10-0 next season……with the talent he has returning next year, Franklin’s chances are really strong. First class facilities, a great coaching staff, a great fan and alumni base, and a committed administration all point to years of Division III prowess ahead for Franklin College Grizzly Football.
Let me put it to you this way, Keith:
If I had $1,000 to bet on HSU and UMHB winning their first round games against anybody other than Wesley, I’d take that action every day of every week of every month of every year. Period. The ASC is, in my mind at least, clearly THE power conference in the South Region, and there is zero doubt in my mind that split up, HSU and UMHB both win their opening round games by three touchdowns (not including a matchup against Wesley).
Of course, we probably will never get to find out, due to the mathematically-challenged folks at the AA.
jpbower,
The three touchdown prediction is a little bold, but – you never know.
Hardin Simmons v. Mary Hardin-Baylor is a slap in the face to the whole conference – as well as the rest of us. Who’s to say the selection committee didn’t consider doing it to the rest of us?
Even though those two teams get the slap, you have to win them all to win it all.
As I wrote yesterday, if high school football teams can schedule regular seaon games out of state (and some do), then D3 selection committee should be able to avoid this from happening.
I understand the whole budget thing, but there comes a time when you may have to spend more than the absolute minimum.
billydog,
Franklin did not lose to an undefeated team. MSJ lost the Bridge Bowl on Saturday to Thomas More, a mediocre team from the PAC. When I saw that score, I knew Franklin was out. When I saw the St. John’s score, there was no doubt.
Unfortunately, MSJ’s loss hurt the HCAC a lot more than just Franklin not getting in. Instead of hosting a first round game against a team like Wittenberg (a team they should have handled easily), now they have to travel to Illinois and face a very good Wheaton. At least they don’t have to go to Alliance this year.
As they mentioned in Around the Nation, the HCAC is unlikely to ever get more than one team in the playoffs until the conference champion can put together a couple good playoff runs. It’s a heck of a lot easier to do that if the champ is 10-0 and gets to play at home in the first round.
Everytime somebody points to the HCAC’s 1-7 playoff record as a possible reason Franklin didn’t get in, it makes me sick. I don’t understand how results of previous years can have an influence on the 2006 bracket, but I suppose it might. However, I’d like to think that while such a record may have an influence on a subconscious level, the selection committee doesn’t use such arguments when they actually discuss teams like Franklin.
Thank God the playoffs start in 2 days. Time to settle all this on the field. I believe that UWW, UMHB or HSU can win the whole thing – just weak that the NCAA gives Mt. Union a cupcake route to the Stagg Bowl to match their regular season schedule.
We’ll never know … but for what it’s worth that 1-7 mark includes a lot of non-competitive performances.
GO ROWAN Crush THE HO’s
Isn’t Hobart a 8-1 team not a 9 -1 dosen’t this make a Team like CS 9-1 worth more
I’ll tell you Cam08 I think you are right, I think Hobart has not shown a lot this year when it comes to being ranked in the top 25. I think they deserve to be in the top 25 because they have won when they have had to. I do think Rowen will win, maybe even big. Plus as a Union fan I am not really a fan of Hobart to begin with, but, from what I have read lately and from what most of the chatter in our D3 world has been. I don’t think there is a team that can prove itself more than Hobart with a win over Rowen this weekend. All the arguments this season about the Statesmen not deserving to be in the top 25 could be setteled. Hobart you have got it all on your plate, the opportunity is there for you. If you can beat Rowen you prove yourselves worthy of all the years ranking and disprove all the non believers. I for one am rooting for you. Hey Pride man, I would love to see what Arcidicano could do if he was the QB is Sprinfields triple option Offense? I think his numbers would put Mr.Sharpe away. I am however really impressed with Sharpe and the Springfield Offense. I wish them lots of luck this week. Overall lets go DUTCHMEN!
Mr.D where have you been? You say the Barttie’s won when they had too but I remeber a game in early Nov. when that is just what they needed to do but didn’t. My lastting impression of that game is when the PA man was talking pre game and talked of the history between the two teams and how Hobart won it 2 years ago then Union last year and soooo I believe the Hobart team heard him and came out and played like it’s supposed to be our turn,someone forgot to tell Union. I am sorry I am turnning in my 3 cornered hat I am sure no one at Hobart will mind
I know I griped in a previous post about Cortland fans not moving on with life because their team did not make the final 32. After reading the subsequent analysis about Cortland being left out, I now certainly see your point and understand why you’d be upset.
D3Keith’s breakdown of the last teams in and out was good stuff. If you were to put Cortland in and take a team out, then one could make a good case that St. John’s would be that team. Their only loss was to the MIAC champ Bethel, but their two non-conference wins were against two WIAC teams (Eau Claire and River Falls) with a combined win total of 6.
Maybe the MIAC is down this year, but can you imagine the uproar if a one loss SJ team who had been a top 5 team all year was left out of the playoffs?
I also follow NAIA football as I’m a Sioux Falls fan and just see some interesting ties to DIII. There are two Bethel teams (KS and TN) playing in the NAIA playoffs in addition to the DIII Bethel from MN (who I respectfully hope get beat by my UW LaCrosse Eagles). NAIA playoff team Black Hills State was beaten 20-0 by 3 win UW Eau Claire. There are some good teams in the NAIA but I wonder how they would stack up against DIII?
Back to UWL…How good are they really? Here is a fun and far-out reach:
The Eagles beat DI-AA South Dakota State 17-3 who beat UC Davis, who whipped Montana State 45-0, who beat Colorado, (yes THE Colorado, not directional Colorado), who beat Texas Tech, who beat Texas A&M, who beat Kansas State, who just beat Texas. KSU also beat Oklahoma State who beat Nebraska. It is likely that Texas and Nebraska will square off in the Big 12 Championship. One of these teams who clearly is not as good as UWL will win the Big 12 and land in a big fat BCS bowl game.
So did Cortland get a raw deal by not making the DIII playoffs? Yes they did, but not nearly as bad as UW-L getting shut out of a BCS bowl game.
I obviously have too much time on my hands!
This sure has been fun to read. As I pack to make a very long drive to Rochester, NY tomorrow to watch Union vs. SJFC I sure do not know what to expect. After reading on the web and rochester news. it sounds like it will not be much of a game according to the players from SJF. I am sure the boys from UC will play with a lot of heart – we always have and I guess have nothing to lose. I am confident Minerva will be shining bright on Saturday. “The day is short, the work is long, your reward is great”.
I will be at the UMHB-HSU game Saturday, it will be fun and close. We got hosed once again because of the stupid NCAA. Millsaps got DESTROYED by a weak ASC team. UMHB or HSU would beat them by 5 TD’S. The NCAA needs to put the same effort into scheduling as they do in trying to be politically correct, like changing teams mascots.(McMurry) The NCAA is a joke.
“Millsaps got DESTROYED by a weak ASC team.”
The good news is, teams never improve from Week 1 to Week 12, especially when Week 1 was their first game under a new head coach. I’m sure that if Millsaps and Mississippi College met today the result would be EXACTLY the same.