Every year I spend my “fall back” extra hour of sleep right here, on the site. Then I look up and think, “crap, is that 2:15 daylight or 2:15 standard?”
So far, still daylight time, I believe.
There’s a couple of teams whom we won’t hear much clamoring for Top 25 consideration after today. Ferrum folks probably will continue. Waxing Greensboro isn’t entirely unique, however. You know the deal, Week 11. Until then it’s just talk.
Saw Wesley just crush Salisbury today. I’ve had the pleasure of watching Salisbury several times in the past few years with Dustin Johnson at quarterback (seriously, the guy is fun to watch), but the Sea Gulls were awful today. They had 11 rushing yards at the half and finished with 76 for the game. Wesley came out with a five-man front that had Salisbury in trouble all day. Meanwhile, Chris Warrick just picked the Salisbury secondary apart (other than All-American Byron Westbrook, whom they worked away from). He hit receivers in perfect stride, and when he didn’t, they came down with jump balls.
Obviously you have to worry about Wesley under less-than-perfect conditions. Dry turf is ideal but a playoff team needs to be able to play in the mud as well, like last week’s 47-0 loss at Brockport.
I would be very surprised now to see Salisbury make the NCAA playoffs. They may struggle at home with Widener next week, because Widener isn’t exactly a pushover.
The three teams who announced this week they were leaving the MAC went 0-3.
Meanwhile, I think those who sat through the entire five-game set at the Metrodome on Friday may still be recovering. Our photographer shot all five games for the league and I have barely seen him online since. (That and the St. John’s/St. Olaf game, which he shot but we have yet to see.) I hope someday the MIAC gets back into the Metrodome.
Interested in:
What Monmouth can do in the playoffs. Will they be like St. Norbert, competitive in every first-round game, or like Lake Forest, the only non-Norbert team to make the playoffs and a 45-0 loser to Wartburg?
Union finally playing one of the other Liberty League front-runners next weekend. Talk about a backloaded schedule. (St. Olaf knows what that is.)
Concerned about:
Hardin-Simmons, though maybe they have found their quarterback by default now.
Can DePauw make it to Monon Bell unscathed?
Rowan, with pieces dropping like flies. Today it was key defender Brian Bond tearing two knee ligaments against Brockport.
Crazy e-mail of the week:
There’s a good set to choose from, including one from a person last night advocating for Johns Hopkins to be in the Top 25. I gave him my honest assessment last night. But I think Hopkins coaches already know they were ranked too high in the AFCA poll … again.
Anyway …
Below is the result of your feedback form. It was submitted by
[name removed] (xxxxxxxxxxxx@uww.edu) on Saturday, October 29, 2005 at 07:17:58 PM
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Subject: UW-Whitewater
Notes: Don’t you think its kinda weird how Whitewater is ranked number 2 in the nation for D3 football and there were no players from Whitewater in the person-all americans and never get any recognition for what they have accomplished this season. I bet if you go and ask anyone outside the state of Wisconsin and ask them where Whitewater is they would not have a clue. Come on now show everybody out there what UW-Whitewater is all about and give them some props.
Thank You
Well, let’s see, recognition. Whitewater has had people on the Team of the Week twice this season, they are, as noted, ranked No. 2 in our poll, they’ve been on the front page at least twice … oh yeah, and Keith McMillan and I have been there this season.
If people don’t know where Whitewater is, it’s not our fault.
Hmm, no, that post was after the clock change. Damn. I’ve wasted another perfectly good hour not sleeping. 🙂
The table is set! Union, with an impressive (finally) victory over St. Lawrence, will meet Hobart next Saturday in Schenectady for bragging rights in the Liberty League. The Duchmen’s passing game eclipsed their formidable running game. Five touchdown passes tied a school mark set last year by Marotti, the current QB.The game was over before halftime.
Union is a very well rounded team. If they bring their “A” game next week, the Hobart game should be a barnburner! A loss would probably knock them out of contention for a playoff spot. A win sets up the all important confrontation with a very good RPI team, winners yesterday over WPI. Should be a great couple of weeks in upstate New YorK!
Bond was hujrt in the Kean game last week, not against Brockport this week.
Bond was hurt in the Kean game last week, not against Brockport this week.
Having Pcole and K-Mack at UW-Whitewater’s Perkins Stadium earlier this year is pretty solid recognition for me. The last time Whitewater has had the recognition they have had this season was back in the Clinton administration!
Whitewater just has to keep doing their talking on the field and the recognition will continue to come! D-3.com has recognized them as the number 2 team in the country and that speaks volumes! Going undefeated in the toughest conference in the country and winning the Conference Championship is the first thing on the “To Do List.” Accomplish that and the rest of the country will be talking!!
Win some playoff games. Period.
That is also on the “To Do List!” They’ll get to it!!
JTW — you should consider reporting such things in your column when they happen.
How about we give a little respect to the boys out at Cal Lutheran they lost to Occidental on the road and have been stroking the rest of California since
I thought about addressing this in the blog — guess this means I should have.
Cal Lu’s non-conference opponents are a combined 4-18. That’s not going to get them very far.
I see you conveniently left off the score of that Oxy/Cal Lu game. It was 41-9.
Also I should note here what I saw posted and later confirmed about the Oxy/P-P game yesterday — final was 41-34 but it was 41-20 with two minutes left and P-P got two scores in garbage time.
Monmouth on the Front Page, Wow! I thought that would only happen if they were getting stomped by a top 10 team. Now we just need to get them in the rankings. The Scots will be one of the final 32, that’s for sure. I know we have beaten the dead horse…well…to death, but MC’s two toughest conference games were both on the road, at 7-2 St. Norbert and at 5-4 Carroll. As previously mentioned in another blog, Carroll is probably 5 plays from being 8-1. It would be nice to get MC in the top 25 this week fellas. You and I both know that if this was that team from DePere, Wis. they would be ranked.
Monmouth should also move up in the West Region rankings after St. Olaf’s debacle vs. St. John’s. I too am interested in what MC will bring to the playoffs. Carroll’s head coach called the Scots “the most dominant MWC team in recent history”, so hopefully we will be competitive in every game.
I’ll be more focused for a change this week.
Bubble trouble: Eventually we’ll post something more formal than this, but until then here’s an updated look at life as a Pool C seed.
Keep in mind these are loses in region. I’ve also added the Pool B teams since they’ll be in the hunt for Pool C bids once you take out four of them.
One loss teams: Augustana, Cal Lutheran, Central, Coe, Concordia-Moorhead, DePauw, John Carroll, UMHB, Montclair State, RPI, St. John Fisher, St. Olaf
Two loss teams: Adrian, Capital, Cortland, CNU, Hampden-Sydney, Howard Payne, Methodist, Ohio Northern, St. Norbert, UW-Eau Claire, UW-Oshkosh, Widener, Wilkes, Wheaton
Pool B teams (regional record): Linfield (5-0), Thiel (8-0), Wesley (5-0), W&J (5-1), Whitworth (4-1) Salisbury (2-1), Willamette (3-0), Huntingdon (5-1)
Focusing on the one-loss teams, keep this mind:
– We’ll add two East teams to the “one loss” list after next week. Alfred and Ithaca play next week. Each has a loss out of region. Hobart plays Union.
– C-M and St. Olaf still have to play each other.
– If Coe and Central both win out, Coe gets the AQ and Central is a C candidate. If Central loses to Wartburg, Coe is a Pool C candidate.
– CLU, DePauw and MSU (4-1 in region) weren’t in the first batch of regional rankings.
So what does all this mean?
12 Teams with one regional loss + Hobart or Union + Alfred or Ithaca – Coe or Central – C-M/St. Olaf – 3 unranked = 9 regionally ranked Pool C teams with one loss.
That’s not to say a two-loss Pool C or one-loss Pool B team couldn’t get in the mix, but that’s where we stand right now.
It is tough to complain about d3 play-off structure considering d-1 doesnt even bother with play-offs, but pardon me for being a “homer”, I ask how could Fisher be a “bubble” play-off team when they are an overtime loss (AT ITHACA BY THE WAY) from being undefeated. They also are 4th in the country in total offense and play a decent schedule (Brockport, Ithaca, Alfred and Springfield on a down year). This is no time to allow the winner of the North Central East Midwest Conference have a free ride into a NATIONAL PLAY-OFF
SJFF82,
They are a bubble team because a pool C bid is not a given right. They have one loss and its not an automatic win in 2 weeks vs AU. Yes their chances are good to get that at large bid, but there are alot of other conferences that also deserve a pool C bid.
Btw, TOU caught a mistake, which I appreciate.
IC has a regional loss to Lycoming. So they should be on the list of one-loss teams, though they could put Alfred in that spot by beating them.
Thanks for the reply ‘upstate’, and excuse my ignorance but is there a place (on this or another website) that explains the whole “pool” system. I dont even know how it works. Why bother with all the polls (d3.com, coaches, etc…) if they dont mean anything?
SJFF82:
http://www.d3football.com/faq.php?question&category=Playoffs
Before you complain about Fisher being a bubble team to get into the “NATIONAL PLAY-OFF”, you should know that the East is usually the weakest region. In fact, the ‘East’ playoff team has been blown out in the national semifinals in recent years.
Thanks for the insight wild cat (meow), but what is the correlation between making a field of 32 and reaching the final four. Is Rowan not deserving of a play-off bid because they lose in the semi or finals every year???
All right, enough of this chit-chat……just give Ferrum the trophy, and nobody gets hurt!! Just kidding though.
There is, however, reason for concern when a team scores TD’s with eight different players in a single game. Options in getting to the endzone are always a plus.
Conversely, one could say there is reason for concern when an opponent can’t stop any of eight players in a single game. 🙂
SJFF82, I think the point is that there are seven Pool C bids and if the NCAA football committee wants a more competitive tournament field, they might choose to put some in other brackets, where lower-seeded teams tend to be successful.
I am not sure I agree, but pretty sure that’s what he’s saying.
Actually being at the game, I would say you both are right. Ferrum could have easily put up 80+ points but any of the top three teams could have scored against Greensboro. I still disagree with the standing and will until Ferrum is ranked. Pat has mentioned that Ferrum will not be taken seriously until the Nov. 12th matchup with CNU.
If you look at teams which CNU and Ferrum have both played one could make an argument that Ferrum could play with(and possibly beat) anyone ranked higher. CNU lost to Rowan by only a TD. Ferrum beat Methodist, a team which also beat CNU by a TD. I know using only game scores to try and determine the strength of a teams is not the most feasable solution. Ferrum though has been very potent on offense no matter which team they have played and the defense has played strong at times or stepped up when needed.
Hmmmm….
Let’s see, coaches from around the country put Ferrum in the top 25 and they are “rightfully” ridiculed for doing so. It’s unfortunate that so many college coaches from around the entire country obviously know so little about the sport that they coach. You would think that after playing the teams and seeing so many other teams on film that they would have a clue…hmmmm…evidently they must not. And to put them ahead of the mighty Bridgewater in the regional rankings–these people have lost their minds!!!!! 😉
Like they did with teams such as Johns Hopkins and Wooster?
Don’t forget #24 St. Olaf 🙂
The AFCA did have Salisbury and UW-La Crosse “correct.”
We all must realize (and we do…we just dont admit it) that ‘our’ sport is limited to the games we attend and reading the “d3 top 25” every week. The d3 coaches do not and should not know much about any team except those they coach and play. It’s not like we are waking up Sun. morning to catch our teams’ results on ESPN. These polls are nothing more than the product of a few entreprenneurs trying trying to capitalize on the excessive sensationalism of college sports.
Here’s hoping d-3 football remains obscure enough that the players will be the only factors that affect the outcome of the season.
Re: Salisbury
First time for everything. They were wrong on Salisbury the past two years. And I wouldn’t really go to the mat for or against any pick in the 20-25 range, whether our pick or theirs — the picks that live on are the ones in the Top 20, like Wooster and Johns Hopkins this year, #11 Hampden-Sydney or #13 Wabash last year, even hyster … err, historical ones such as Top 15 Ohio Wesleyan a few years back.
Everyone makes mistakes. Good points SJFF82. These coaches are not in touch with the talent of teams outside of their own conference, let alone their region. They don’t have that kind of time. They do the same thing that many of us do, they look at the name, record, and scores of their games.
As far as polls being wrong: Both polls have their faults. That’s what happens when you are trying to cover a Nationwide sport that has 220+teams. Especially with the parity that we have today. I will say this to the Ferrum fans: I don’t feel a bit sorry for you not being ranked in this poll. Monmouth is 9-0 this season and is coming off of a conference championship clinching road win versus a better than .500 team, and we lost ground to you. You beat St. Mary’s School for the Blind 55-0, and are now ranked ahead of us by the experts. Funny though, I believe it was Pat Coleman who told me that beating the brains out of bad teams won’t get you any extra votes in our poll. That comment was following MC’s 69-14 thumping of 1-7 Grinnell.
The fact is that the only people that care about this crap is us. MC coach Steve Bell will start being concerned about his ranking as soon as they hand out the D3 national championship trophy for cracking the D3football.com top 25. Right now MC is looking at playing one of the top 3 teams in the country in the opening round of the playoffs (because they’re all in our region), and I’m sure that concerns them more than where they are ranked by a group of bias sports writers.
You were doing great until you had to throw out the bias card. Why cap a great comment with a cheap shot? That’s the thing that bothers me most about dealing with people is that so many times they automatically assume there is bias against them, rather than that the collective opinion of the 25 voters doesn’t think very highly of their team.
And we rarely hear from those readers again when the voters turn out to be right.
Sorry Pat,
I got the confirmation Saturday. I thought it was bad when I saw it happen at Kean, but I wanted to be sure.
Sorry Pat. The bias card was uncalled for. I’m just frustrated. I know that you guys are doing the best you can with limited time and revenue, and you can’t cover everyone. I’m just looking down the throat of the toughest region in division 3 knowing that the Scots will likely lose in the first round and they will never receive the recognition they deserve before or after. I shouldn’t pick on Ferrum either, they’re not the only team we have to jump over, they just happen to be an extra one from last week’s poll.
One question though: Not ranking MC seems to be the safe bet considering their likely first round opponent(s). But what happens when the voters are wrong? The Scots could be the 5th or 6th best in the West, and still be in the top 25.
Again, my apologies.
Hey GoScotties,
Why worry about having to play a tough team in the playoffs? You have to win them all to get the big trophy anyway. Any yes, it will be difficult for Monmouth to finally take on a ranked opponent.
All teams have a weakness, all Momouth has to do is find the weakness of the opponent in the playoffs.
Like I have said in the past, call whoever schedules your games and have them schedule a tough (a commonly ranked team) for your nonconference game. Then teams will have to worry about passing Monmouth – not Monmouth pasing them. For example, next week #17 Augustana takes on #11 North Central for what will be most likely for the conference championship. Even if Augie was to not win, they still may be ranked due to the schedule they play. North Central will be the 3rd ranked team they will play. Their only loss was an OT loss to #22 Central.
Respect comes from the quality of schedule and quality of victory. Augustana has tons of respect.
Good luck in the playoffs – unless you play Augie.
SeanGOP:
No doubt playing ranked opponents before the playoffs has it’s advantages. It will be interesting to see who MC schedules next year. The big issue isn’t playing ranked teams for the first time in the playoffs, it’s that those teams are the 1,2,3 in the country! Good Luck against North Central, that would be a great came to watch. It looks like Augie’s schedule is a little backloaded with Wheaton next week. The Vikings will have to play great football just to get in! The upside is the confidence that they will have entering regional play if they can make it.
YOUR ARGUMENT AGAINST CLU THAT THEIR NON-CONFERENCE SCHEDULE WON’T GET THEM FAR DOESN’T HOLD MUCH WATER WHEN OXY’S NON-CONFERENCE WINS CAME AGAINST CHAPMAN,2-5, (WITH A WIN OVER LEWIS AND CLARK), LEWIS & CLARK, 0-4, (NOT PLAYING OUT THE SEASON), AND COLORADO COLLEGE, 1-7. (THEIR ONLY WIN IS OVER L&C). GRANTED, CLU LOST TO OXY, BUT THE OFFICIATING WAS TOTALLY BIASED AGAINST THEM, AND THEY HAD 2 TURNOVERS IN THE RED ZONE. OVERALL CLU HAS ONE OF THE BEST DEFENSES IN THE COUNTRY. 27TH IN TOTAL DEFENSE AND 12TH IN RUN DEFENSE GOING INTO LAST WEEKS GAME. A LITTLE RECOGNITION WOULD BE NICE.
Yet Occidental beat CLU, as you point out. Biased officiating? It was a 32-point game! Come on now …
GoScotties:
Good point about the West region. That would be a tough draw since 1,2,3 are in the West. There are never any easy games in the playoffs. Maybe some teams get lucky in the first round, but after that, noone is lucky, and everyone is just as freaked about losing as the next team.
GO AUGIE!! BEAT NORTH CENTRAL!!
GoScotties, you have some value as a QOWI-boosting team. A victory over Monmouth is worth 14-15 points (in-region record %age > .666). There are probably some teams that would want their QOWI boosted, and you are a good candidate.
Take advantage of that! That will get you some good opponents!
From an unbiased observer, is “bias” the word of the week? lol
pitkaine-
OXY won big in the playoffs last year. They had a core group from that team coming back. CLU does not deserve recognition until they do the same.
Lycoming is on the way back…three wins in a row starting win Ithaca….should win out for five in a row and go into next season with offense intact. DelVal will lose QB, RB and other seniors….Lyco back on top in the MAC in ’06!!!!!!
>>GRANTED, CLU LOST TO OXY, BUT THE OFFICIATING WAS TOTALLY BIASED AGAINST THEM, AND THEY HAD 2 TURNOVERS IN THE RED ZONE
Oxy scored the first 5 times they had the ball against CLU and were up 31-0 before CLU scored. The Tigers kicked the Kingmen’s butts. Period.
Bob,
All too true. However, look at Cal Lutheran as a contender next year and beyond. They’ve got a good shot at an 8-1 season only Whittier, Chapman left), best since they were and NAIA power in the late ’70s, early ’80s. Only 13 seniors on this year’s team; Danny Jones is likely to be a four-year all-SCIAC pick (second team as a freshman, probably the same this year), and they’ve got a lot of good young players. They’re probably a year and a healf from being at their best.
doodle:
I think it’s great having CLU in the conference. I hope the Kingsmen get stronger just like Oxy has the past few years. The better the teams, the better the competition, and that’s good for the SCIAC. Besides, it’s great to see someone else beat Redlands, too!
I have just learned that MC will begin a non-conference series with Wartburg next year. Give Coach Bell credit, he’s obviously looking to improve the quality of the Scots schedule. Wartburg will definitely be a formiddable opponent, and the series should benefit both schools. How much different would 9-0 look with a win over Wartburg instead of CUW!
Wanted to congratulate Monmouth on clinching!! Good luck to you in the play-offs! What a great season!
Go Scotties, a 10-0 Monmouth (10-0 in-region) with a win over Wartburg probably gets you a first round home game.
Ralph: You’re right, I don’t think there’s any doubt that replacing an IBC school with an Iowa Conference contender would improve the Scots standing.
wiac watcher: Thanks for the congratulatory remarks. Unfortunately, the Scots may have to bring their undefeated record to Whitewater, Wisc. That’s a heck of a lot more than a test! Oh well, you can’t prove yourselves worthy contenders by beating up on the nobodys, right?
Hey all,
great discussion. Loved the point about the coaches being consumed with their own teams and the better-schedule/better ranking point.
I’m trying not to sound mean, but it’s going to come out that way. Some of you should listen to yourselves.
When I played, and cared about only one school and how we did each week, I too was probably guilty of overestimating how much our success meant on a national level (shoot, I still think my ’97 squad could stay within a couple TDs of Rowan or Mount Union).
When I became fortunate enough to write for this site, and step back and look at the big picture, I began to understand where certain strengths lie. And that changes every year … two years ago, there was no way we’d believe there would be a top 5 SCIAC team. But respect is earned, not given.
Someone above mentioned something laughable about us being entreprenuers … I guess, but it hardly feels that way. Nobody here is raking in the dough. We do it because we all went to D3 schools and hated how we couldn’t find out anything about the teams we were about to play. We love this level and believe it deserves coverage like anything else.
That said, don’t confuse the polls with the playoffs. I think that’s one thing Division III has over Division I-A. SJF, I think, said the polls were meaningless. I wouldn’t say that, they just aren’t in any way related to the playoff picture. And that’s good.
Because we can get the best estimate of the 25 best teams in the country. And we also don’t have to depend on the pollsters to get it right or live with it if they don’t.
So many people are insulted by the poll, and question it … only when their team isn’t high enough. You don’t hear anyone from Whitewater saying “ehh, we should probably be behind Mount Union until someone from our conference wins a couple of playoff games.”
I know I’m being condescending and whatever, but you all should be thanking these people for ignoring their wives and girlfriends all fall so they can watch football and make sense of 230 schools, and give it to you free so you can have something to talk about. I played not that long ago, and we didn’t have anything but the local paper and the NCAA regional rankings, for real. … And these guys have done such a good job with this poll since it started. It’s the best thing out there, whether you like where your team is or not. Trust me, we’re better for having it. No poll is right all time, some teams will out play their ranking, and a lot will fall in line.
As far as your team not being ranked, look at it like this … our division is so big that at least seven unranked teams will have a playoff game and a chance at a national championship in two weeks. I’d rather be in the 32 than the top 25.
You can tell me where to stick it if you want, but you know I’m right.