Congrats to Mount Union. Nice to have a different champion for once. π But seriously, I don’t mind if the same team wins a couple titles in a row, as long as the season is competitive and the title isn’t a forgone conclusion.
We’ve had years like that.
First thought goes out to the johnny-come-lately Whitewater posters on this blog. Welcome to Division III reality. It takes more than one hand to count the number of schools’ posters who have come in, talked a big game, then had to either slink away or eat crow. But don’t worry, there’s a long list: Wheaton, Wabash, Widener, Rowan, St. John’s (though that one goes both ways).
Second to those who insisted the national title game was played two weeks ago. ‘Nuff said. Don’t count your chickens before the eggs are laid. This is exactly why covering Division III and ranking teams is so difficult.
Third: Can you imagine this team with two more years of Pierre Garcon and three more of Nate Kmic? In our pregame interview I asked coach Larry Kehres if we were seeing the emergence of the next Chuck Moore or Dan Pugh and he pointed out, of course, that those guys did it for four years. In retrospect, however, I think we’ll be able to look back in a couple years and agree about the breakout.
Fourth: Still thinking about the chicken, Stone Station! Yum!
Also, I enjoyed covering sideline reports for the broadcast today (archive links on the front for those who want to listen in). Good perspective on the game. Thanks to Matt Barnhart of Bridgewaterfootball.com for covering the opposite sideline for me so we could get the latest on both sides.
Good to see the NCAA’s chief executive, Dr. Myles Brand, watching the game from the sidelines. We were able to interview him early in the third quarter for those who want to check it out.
As always, play in the Stagg Bowl would have changed our All-American team. But like everyone else, we lock them in and release them beforehand.
Our broadcasters upstairs correctly noted the downfield blocking by the offensive line on Kmic’s 15-yard touchdown run But I feel I should point out that Garcon was down there as well paving the way.
It was great to see officiating not be an issue. The officials clearly got the three calls right that resulted in the game being stopped for review. But it was fun from the field to see the video board and how the replays shown affected the fans, especially on the non-touchdown catch by Garcon — the play was called out of bounds. First replay comes up and is not particularly conclusive to the layman, Mount Union fans roar. Play is stopped. I call upstairs to Gordon Mann, our producer, and let him know it is absolutely out of bounds. Second replay comes up and shows us nothing new. Finally, the definitive replay shows Garcon indeed got his foot down out of bounds and the Whitewater side roars. I enjoyed the element added to the game and hope fans did too.
Now, on to the Aztec Bowl. Thanks to Wes Hostetler for making us look good with his performance as both a defensive back and a return man, echoing our naming him an All-American at both spots earlier in the day. Elsewhere, lots of good performances came from our picks … just not from the quarterbacks. Ouch.
We throw it open, but don’t forget to come back for more coverage this week and in future weeks as we continue to wrap up the Stagg Bowl and the 2005 Division III football season with Keith McMillan’s year in review column.
sitlux,
Thanks for explaining that to me. I wasn’t sure what it meant. I am one of those “Johhny-come-lately,s” who hasn’t payed attention to D-3 football until I had a personal reason to do so in the last few years. I am not familiar with all the history.
Mt.Union is doing the Same kind of Deal with a school in Virginia for the next two years ( Averett Univ)
Sitlux, did you NOT read where I said that many WIAC teams who are champions usually do not go through the conference with relative ease like Whitewater did??
I didn’t think so. Put the whole quote in there, not just the part where you want to ridicule.
No tmany teams go through the WIAC like UW-W did, which was surprising, and therefore, put their team above the rest and made a strong case for one of the best teams in the nation.
That’s all.
We’ve had this stupid argument the last few weeks leading up to the national championship. Drop it, already. Move on.
No problem wiac…I had to eat crow that year never thought Mt. would take that pounding against the Johnnies (especially when a good amount came from them killing Kinnard). I’m mainly a D1 fan but my MUC roots keeps me paying attention to what goes on here…this sight becomes addicting in the fall.
WIAC as best conference conversation…dropped (hurt foot though due to the weight the argument has carried) Note to self: next time drop lighter conversations or drop further from foot. π
I think D-III should go to a BCS format!!!!
I think if they played again Saturday UWW would roll Mount Union probably 42-14. The whole Awe of the stagg bowl would be gone and they could play loose football. I will say it will be tough for UWW to get back. Lacrosse will reload, St Johns was young also. I think talentwise Wiac much better then OIC. Many more Nfl PLayers. Mount Union ever had a player stick?
Eric
iknowitall
We all know that won’t happen. They had their chance and will need to earn a spot next year. Just like Mt. Union and all other D3 schools will be fighting for. This is why alot of people were trying to tell SeanGOp & yourself. ITS AN ENTIRE NEW BALLGAME Championship Day. W-W may have been the best team in the Nation this year. But, they were very tight and by the time they realized they were in the National Championship Game they found themselves down 28-7 to Mt. Union. Not only was they team tight but it was very clear to all who watched the game. The W-W coach felt the pressure and made decisions he probably won’t make again. They had a great year, Will most likely be one of the top 4 teams in the country next year.
Iknowitall,
Don’t be so arrogant about WW rolling MUC in a rematch. Many things contributed to the loss as addresssed by jimjearsa but a big part was also the play of MUC defense. Great defenses make great teams play badly!! You are right about it being tough to get back going through the WIAC, however.
I was the guy going on and on about how UWW was going to win it all, after all, they had the toughest path to the finals, and they came from the strongest confernce in the country (According to Massey Ratings).
Hats off to Mount Union. I honestly think after seeing the players on that team that they will be playing for the National Championship next year as well. If I played against Mt. Union I would score a touchdown every time I touched the ball – out of the fear of being tackled by one of those giants.
I still love the WIAC and the CCIW, and it bums me that my team did not win it all, but I have to say I was impressed with Mt. Union – Wow.
I can’t wait for next year.
Where in the heck did “Your comment is awaiting moderation.” come from?
Iknowitall, I thought you were all done with the ridiculous comments. It’s all in heinsight. Nobody else is in denial that Mount beat Whitewater and is the D3 champion.
SeanGOP, I never heard of such a thing. Maybe it’s new?
Next year will be great. I know WW is already making plans for Salem but don’t think it is that easy. Linfield was the odds on favorite this year and lost in the quarters. Remember, the west region has been the toughest top to bottom so to make plans now is crazy. I think all the WIAC schools, Linfield, St. Johns and Concordia will have something to say about WW making it back to the Stagg Bowl.
Merry Christmas and congrats to both WW and MU. You had great seasons!
fb fan:
You are right – making plans now is a good way to be disappointed later. Nevertheless, I’m sure next year will be another great year for the “usual” cast of characters – St. Johns, Rowan, Linfield, UWW, Mt. Union, etc. Will be entertaining, as always, to see it all play out.
I didn’t mean to leave out Rowan, I was referring to the West Region. Arguably the toughest region each year. Anyway, I can’t wait until next year. It should be great!
Oh no no.. I wasn’t picking at you. I was only pointing out that the “regulars” will all be back again next year. It will definitely be great!
jimjearsa,
try e-mailing me at: mainjack@comcast.net
I think the most amazing observation I could make after this weekend is SeanGOP has found his spell check button.
Save your “Onions” for the next Warhawk burger.
Great game by both teams. I saw Whitewater play twice this year and they were the real deal as billed. Gave a great accounting of themselves and played hard till the end. I too think they will be bac next year to challenge for conference and national honors.
Keep up the good work.
No one will ever have all the answers about the playoffs until they are seated like D1. That is, the top 4 teams are all seeded number one in each sectional. This is not like this year when 3 of the top teams were in the West.
As to the toughness of the WIAC, Last year UWP beat Thiel on the road by 3 touchdowns, with a 6-4 team Thiel finished 7-3. This year Thiel made it into the playoffs to the Second Round. My school finished 1-9, losing four winnable games. When the playoffs are expanded next year, strength of schedule and conference needs to be factored in. Both the OAC and WIAC need to get more then one team in. God bless you guys and have a Merry Christmas!
UWPCJ77
I didn’t know the playoffs were being expanded next year. Did I miss something? Also, three of the top teams were not in west. MUC, WW, Linfield, Capital and Rowan were the top five teams. Two in the west, two in the north and one from the east.
I didn’t really want to get into this….BUT
IKNOWITALL
We gave you credit for “Manning” up and admiting that your predictions were clueless. But to come back with the “If they played again” argument three days later is pathetic. Let’s examine the facts.
Offense: WW 86 plays for 438 yards.
MUC 63 plays for 439 yards. WW ran 23 more plays to gain one yard less.
QB: Jacobs 22-47-1 for 310 yards and 3 sacks.
Jorris 20-28-1 for 246 yards and 1 sack.
WW threw 19 more times for 54 more yards
Running Backs: Beaver 30 carries 125 yards
Kmic 28 Carries 185 yards
Beaver carries two more time for 60 yards less
Of course, Kmic had 95 on one carry. But all great coaches know that if you give a great runner the ball enough times, he will eventually break a big one. Beaver’s longest carry: 16 yards.
Star Receivers: Stanley 7 for 99 yards and NO TD’s
Garcon 7 for 107 yards and 2 TD’s
Which brings us to the defense. Hands down, MUC’s defense owned the game. They are the reason that MUC is holding the trophy. WW gets in the red zone 5 times and scores 3. MUC scores all three times they are there.
Mount Union controlled the line of scrimmage the enitre afternoon. Both sides of the ball.
And then there is the coaching!!!!
If they played tomorrow, MUC would win again. If they played in March, MUC would win again. If they played in May, MUC would win again. BUT, come June when players graduate, everything changes. That’s why they will start all over again in August 06.
You made a comment last week that we would all soon know why you have the “handle” that you have. I guess we are still waiting to figure that out.
To all:
In some people’s minds, the actual results of the championship game are not sufficient enough evidence to indicate the better team. As this dialogue could continue ad nauseum, I am officially signing off until next year.
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year. It’s been a pleasure.
Mainjack,
Those are the final rankings based on the playoffs. We all know that if Wesley (semis) was in the west they would not have made it past the second round. Also, Rowan would not have been in the semi’s had they played in the West. In fact, last years semis Rowan 0 Linfield 56. So the final rankings are not really honest because they are based on how they did in the playoffs.
Consider this. Linfield barely beat Concordia. Concordia barely lost to St. Johns. St. Johns lost to WW badly but turned the ball over 8 times. WW barely beat Linfield. WW almost beat MU.
I will not argue about MU because they are the standard which all other d3 programs are compared. My only point is the West has been stacked the last 3 years. Infact, the last 3 years the winner from the west has either won or played for the National Championship. Also, all three of those teams won close West regional Championship games and then won huge in the semi’s.
Last post of the year. Hope everyone has a great Christmas and new year.
Not gonna lie here, but a bunch of you people make me dizzy and sick reading this blog…
Same arguments, different teams, different conferences…different year.
Phew
Your right Pat. I think we are all pretty loyal to our schools and it hurts when we lose. I am just glad we have a great web page and forum to read and discuss what is happening around the nation. Once again, I can’t wait until next year. Will Mount repeat…again? Will we have a rematch? How much will Linfield fall without Brett Elliot? Many questions. But as we all know, they will all be answered next year.
fbfan
“So the final rankings are not really honest because they are based on how
they did in the playoffs.” So I suppose elections are not really honest because they’re based on actual votes and not polls? “…the West has been stacked the last 3 years.” Instead of being proud of all the good teams in the West region you complain because they actually have to play against each other to represent the region. I guess the NCAA isn’t politically correct enough for the West region–we need afirmative action to help them out. Still, even with all those titans in the West Region, the West’s declared “Nat’l Champ” couldn’t win it all. The tears roll down the cheeks of all football fans for the injustice done to the west teams—NOT.
Mainjack, I’m just asking and I’m not trying to be a toad, but with all the rambling about stats, did I decipher right that you think Kmic is better than Beaver? I’m just wondering, I don’t want to open a can of worms.
Gee, sure hope we can find something else to talk about besides the “what ifs” and “if onlys” for the next 7 months. Until then……..you know I really think that “if only” H-SC had made the playoffs, they would have scored “at least” 50 on both MUC and W-W. MUC and W-W would have scored “at most” 20. π d3hoops.com, watch out, here I come.
Merry Christmas everyone!!
lilpeds-
YES- Kmic was better than Beaver in last saturday’s championship game- the stats prove that.
Why is that so hard to understand?
Obviosuly the stats don’t lie. And it isn’t har dto understand. Why do you assume so much?
Can’t answer a simple question without firing back…
Would you take Kmic over Beaver for a whole season? Again, a simple question that is basically yes or no. No need to fire back with some lame attempt at a witty comeback.
Here’s a salient point you guys are overlooking: Kmic was running against UW-Whitewater’s defense and Beaver was running against Mount Union’s defense. Whitewater’s defense allowed 29% more yards per game over the course of the season.
Now there is something I was dumb enough not to look up.
Thanks Pat.
I’d take Beaver. And lots of it π
Yeah I’m bias, I don’t care though.
We can all agree they are both outstanding running backs.
What year is Beaver? A junior? I know Nate Kmic is only a freshman. Frankly, I think it’s too hard to say I’d take one or the other for the course of an entire season. How about both of them? Imagine that backfield….
lilpeds-
holy smokes- you’ve driven me off this website- and you are probably happy about that.
i’m out….
Wow,
These posts have become really tough to read. I’m a UWW fan and even I know that the only important debate was settled Saturday by a score of 35-28. We can talk all day about the if’s, maybe’s, coulda, shoulda, woulda’s, but it won’t change the fact that on that particular day Mount Union played the better game, WAS the better team and deserved to win. Any argument about who the better team MAY be is mute. And “Iknowitall”, please do this forum a huge favor and slowly(ok maybe not so slowly)fade off into the sunset. Your constant, less than brilliant comments make all UWW fans look stupid. I especially like your prognostication that if UWW played MUC again they’d roll them by the score of 42-14. If you’re livelihood depends on predicting the outcome or scores of sporting events, you’re in the wrong line of work. And it may be in everyone’s best interest to wait a couple of years before we even attempt to compare Beaver and Kmic
Oh yeah,
I almost forgot. Once again, congrats to Mount Union for a great win last saturday and I’d like to wish everyone a Merry Christmas and a safe and prosperous New Year. Until then…….
fb fan,
You asked the question of how far will Linfield fall without Brett Elliott. That’s a good question but Linfield was pretty good too before Brett Elliott (Ranked #3 in the final 2003 poll).
However the losses Linfield takes this season extends far great that at QB (which is a big loss). The Γ’β¬ΛCats will no longer have their 3 starting WR who were so key into the over the past 3-4 years (Allen (A-A 1st team in ’04 & ’05), Hazenberg (A-A in ’04), and McKecknie), they also lose their best DE (Tom), best LB (Olsen (2005 A-A 2nd team)), 3 year starting Safety (Ort (2005 1st team A-A)), and both corners.
I don’t think fans will have the expectations of the previous few years but I think Linfield is going to surprise some folks with some young talent they have in stock. While I don’t think they’ll be putting up 49 points a game they’ll still be in the West Region mix as a player.
wildcat:
Kind of interesting you say that. I’ve been guilty of thinking that certainly {insert year} would be the year Mount Union would be talent-deficient and either be beaten or not have a good playoff run. And so far, I’ve been wrong nearly every year. It seems that these teams are deep at many of the skilled positions and are redadily able to re-load. I won’t be surprised to see Linfield highly rated and a factor once again next year. Gratned, they sound as though they are losing a LOT, but who’s to say what’s coming in won’t be better?
I think it’s about time Augustana make passing a part of their game. Each time they played MUC they got behind big and couldn’t do anything about it. Down by 30+ points but throw the ball only twice? The kids desreve better. Thoughts?
jdean,
I guess I hit a nerve! Sorry about that. I know that we play regionally. And I know you seem to think the West is overrated. My only point was that the west is deeper. When St. Johns won in 2003 they had to come from behind at half to beat Linfield 31-25. They blew out RPI in the semis and kind of handled MU in the final. Last year Linfield came from 14 down to Occidental and won. Then they played Rowan in a Tight Semifinal 56-0. Although they were never behind Mary-Hardin Baylor played them tough in the final.
How can Wesley win a region and then get beat so badly in the Semi’s? Last year how can Rowan win a region and then get beat by 56. The West as we all know had 5 undefeated teams it’s bracket. They were going to get beat early. Therefore they will not finish as high as other schools because the West was more difficult.
The great thing is we all have our opinions. This forum let’s up express them. Doesn’t mean I am right. This is just what I believe. Didn’t mean to get you all fired up. As far as I am concerned unless you are from MU then you don’t have much to say. Without them the West would win every year.
Jdean,
By the way. Since you brought up elections. What about winning the popular vote but losing the election? I guess that’s ok with you.
iceman,
I wouldn’t say that I think Linfield will be talent-deficient but they are going to have “young” talent in some key spots. How quickly that young talent comes along will go a long way into seeing how Linfield’s 2006 season turns out. There are going to be some tough games out of the shoot.
wildcat:
Yeah, talent-deficient wasn’t the right choice of words. I was thinking of the Mount teams when they graduated a really talented player (i.e. Ballard at QB, Ed Bubonics at WR) and no one had really ever heard of the next coming. It didn’t seem to matter who filled the shoes or what class they were.
I will wager that as the season goes on, Linfield will only get better and better. Look forward to seeing you in the playoffs again next year!
Wildcat1144,
I am very aware of Linfield’s history. I have been a fan of Linfield for quite some time. 4 National titles and 3 runnerups as well as countless playoff appearances. I know they will reload I was just posing the question. I know coach Locey and coach Smith will do a great job once again next year.
fb fan,
“As far as I am concerned unless you are from MU then you donβt have much to say. Without them the West would win every year.”
When did you start following division III football? I’ll agree that the West has fielded some strong teams in recent years, but you don’t have to look very far to see that your statement is false. In 2002, Trinity (South Region) defeated the West Region champ in the semis. In 2001, MUC monkey stomped the West Region champ before losing to BC (South Region) by 3 in the finals. In 1998, Rowan (East Region) beat the West Region champ before falling to MUC, then Rowan beat MUC in ’99 to end the Raiders 54 game win streak.
Who knows. Without Mount Union, maybe Capital or another North Region team would have won this year or in other years. But one thing is certain: MUC isn’t the only team to beat the West Region champs in recent years.
Correction…MUC beat BC by 3 in the 01 Stagg.
mizzou,
How did the west region champ do against Rowan in that 1999 stagg bowl? π
FB fan:
Sorry, I can’t amend the Constitution. Election complaints go to a higher pay grade than me. I have no control over the selection committee or the NCAA either so we’ll both have to live with their placements and seedings. I would not argue that the West had some excellent teams this year and probably was the strongest region. But if you went back beyond 3 years you would find that same disproportional strength in other Regions. Its not as if year after year the West has all the good teams and the rest have just Mount Union and maybe Rowan. There is a saying I keep hearing–you have to beat the best to be the best–that applies whether your region has eight undefeated teams or none.
PS I am a Mount fan but selected UWW in our pickem contest.
BTW…how will Mount be ranked at the beginning of next season? I mean, I’m very aware of the answer but I just wanted to pose the question. π
…..yes fb fan, that was directed towards you for asking a question that you didn’t want an answer for or would tell someone who took the time to give their thoughts, that you were already ‘very aware’ of the answer. π